The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

It’s no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Senior Member brihead301's Avatar
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    Upper/Lower split

    After doing full-body workouts for almost 2 years now, I think I want to change things up to an upper/lower split. My gains are coming along just fine with full-body, but I want to change to avoid boredom.

    I'm thinking a 4-day split, but I'm only going to go 3 days per week:

    Day 1: Upper – vertical dominant
    BB OH Press – 3 x 5
    Weighted pull-ups/chin-ups - 3 x 5
    DB Bench – 3 x 8
    Dips (weighted) – 3 x 8

    Day 2: Lower – quad dominant
    squat – 3 x 5
    SLDL – 3 x 8
    Power cleans – 5 x 3 ramping
    Core work

    Day 3: Upper – horizontal dominant
    Flat bench – 3 x 5
    Rows – 3 x 5
    DB shoulder presses – 3 x 8
    Chin-ups/pull-ups - 2 x failure

    Day 4: Lower – ham dominant
    Deadlift – 1 x 5
    Front squats – 3 x 5
    Back squats – ramp to a moderate set of 10
    Core work

    See each day has 3 x 5 heavy sets of the "Big 6" - Squat, deadlift, OH press, Flat bench, rows, and pull-ups.

    - The "assistance" work would be lighter weight or higher rep stuff of the non-dominant movement for each day (front squats, DB work, power cleans, SLDL, etc..).

    What do ya'll think about this? I just need a change from the full-body stuff, because it's getting very boring.
    How to Find Your Dream Job
    My personal blog/website dedicated to giving answers on the age old question - how to escape the "rat race". I now play guitar for a living!

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  3. #2
    Go Bears Pete22's Avatar
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    Looks pretty decent, but I would put the front squats in place of back squats on your quad dominant day, and just do back squats on day four. I did an upper/lower split a few years back and I got some decent results. You seem to have all the key lifts in there and planned out well.
    My Training Log

    You want science and studies? **** you. I've got scars and blood and vomit. - Jim Wendler

  4. #3
    The Flyfisher rbtrout's Avatar
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    ^^^What Pete said.
    Give chalk a chance.


    49 years old

    665 squat
    700 deadlift
    325 bench

  5. #4
    Senior Member brihead301's Avatar
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    Thanks. Would you think that I should do lower reps for the back squats on day 4 rather then ramping to a set of 10?? It would seem that back squats are much more important then front squats IMO.
    How to Find Your Dream Job
    My personal blog/website dedicated to giving answers on the age old question - how to escape the "rat race". I now play guitar for a living!

  6. #5
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    The only thing I dont like it where cleans are. I simply dont think the justification Rip gives for putting cleans near the end of a WO is very good. I really think they should be first. The movement is very complex--- more so than squats and you need to be fresh for that kind of movement. Just my 2 cents.
    Sarvamangalam!

  7. #6
    Go Bears Pete22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZenMonkey View Post
    The only thing I dont like it where cleans are. I simply dont think the justification Rip gives for putting cleans near the end of a WO is very good. I really think they should be first. The movement is very complex--- more so than squats and you need to be fresh for that kind of movement. Just my 2 cents.
    I think Wendler even recommended doing cleans first if you're going to incorporate them into 5/3/1. It was asked in his Q&A a few weeks ago.
    My Training Log

    You want science and studies? **** you. I've got scars and blood and vomit. - Jim Wendler

  8. #7
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    Interesting. Ive never thought about programming cleans like 5/3/1. This may be something I have to try sometime. But, I agree about prioritizing them at the beginning of the WO.
    Sarvamangalam!

  9. #8
    Senior Member brihead301's Avatar
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    Ya, I remember you said that to me before Zen. Honestly, I haven't really noticed a difference in placing them first or last in my sessions. I usually don't feel fatigued at all while in the gym. It's after I get home and out of the shower that I'm dead.
    How to Find Your Dream Job
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  10. #9
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brihead301 View Post
    Ya, I remember you said that to me before Zen. Honestly, I haven't really noticed a difference in placing them first or last in my sessions. I usually don't feel fatigued at all while in the gym. It's after I get home and out of the shower that I'm dead.
    Its not subjective. There are no two ways about it. The clean is a multi stage movement that requires fresh muscles to be performed in such a way that you can keep increasing your poundage. Form break down happens within a few sets of cleans so it will certainly break down after squats and sldls. My recommendation is dont do that.
    Sarvamangalam!

  11. #10
    Senior Member brihead301's Avatar
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    I've been stuck at 165 lbs. on cleans. Maybe it's because I warm up with 135 x 3, 145 x 3, 155 x 3, then I shoot for 165 x 3. Maybe I'm just tired after the 3 warm-up sets.
    How to Find Your Dream Job
    My personal blog/website dedicated to giving answers on the age old question - how to escape the "rat race". I now play guitar for a living!

  12. #11
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    Id do 4 sets of 2 reps for warmup (with even incremental increase) and then do 2-3 working sets of 2 reps across(same weight). Treat the reps like singles. Aim for perfect form EVERY time you clean and you will increase.
    Sarvamangalam!

  13. #12
    Squat Heavy, Squat Often Cards's Avatar
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    I like the setup. It's similar to what i'm using now except i've cut mine to a 2 day split using horizantal and vertical planes. I really enjoy it and it makes things more interesting. I've seen some pretty decent gains on it aswell.
    H: 5'7" W:185
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