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Thread: A Weak Persons Journey To Strength...

  1. #2501
    LuNa
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    ME Lower 03-20-2012

    Squats, BWxmany
    Leg swings to various sides


    Rack pulls
    2x8x60kg (135lbs)
    6x110kg (245lbs)
    5x135kg (295lbs)
    3x165kg (365lbs)
    2x190kg (420lbs)
    1x205kg (450lbs)
    0x245kg (540lbs) <- It wouldnt budge, while this was still a warm up set, goal was to et 1x270kg (595lbs)
    1x245kg (540lbs) <- it came up pretty slow and i almost blacked out at lock out.
    0x230kg (505lbs) <- wanted to get more volume in but again it wouldn't budge.

    Strength really wasnt there today. Not sure why, could be that i was sick last week which causes me to loose around 7lbs. Maybe im just getting weaker...

    Pause squats
    6xbar
    6x60kg (135lbs)
    6x80kg (175lbs)
    6x100kg (225lbs)
    6x120kg (265lbs)

    Weight on my back felt incredibly light. Kept volume up as i didnt get in much on the rack pulls. Pause was around a 2-3 count at the bottom. I think the speed work has really helped my out of the bottom strength.

    Front Squat Holds
    110x10s (245lbs) <- i count to 10, trying to do it slowly which isnt always easy because my spine is trying to jump out of my body
    130x10s (285lbs)
    150x10s (330lbs)
    160x10s (35lbs)

    DB Side bends
    15x38's (84's)
    15x44's (96's)
    10x48's (106's)

    Back raises
    10xBW+20kg (45lbs)
    8xBW+20kg (45lbs)

  2. #2502
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazzyG View Post
    240lbs! Nice!
    I dropped around 7lbs from when i was ill. Goal at the moment is still 265lbs, but with the carb backloading i seem to be having more trouble with gaining.

  3. #2503
    LuNa
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    Will list some goals and realizations when i get to work. Need to go catch my train .

    Edit:
    During the last couple of weeks i realised a few things which i will need to focus on the coming weeks:
    • I did not like structuring my training in blocks. I rather adjust based on how i am feeling, i.e. if i feel beat up i might take a 3rm or a 5rm instead for a couple of weeks. I think the high volume speed work was very good, but also rather throw that in for a couple weeks when im worn out then have a fixed structure.
    • For my squat to increase, i need to have heavy weight on my back more frequent. This will build confidence and ill get used to the feeling of heavy weight. Therefore, almost all ME Lower lifts will be back squats or Good Mornings.
    • My bench has not increased at all the last weeks, maybe months. I thought my weakness was my back, but i can row close to, or even more, then i can bench. My OH press has always been weak and has not increased since my first year, so i will be including a lot more shoulder pressing.
    • I am going to pick 3-4 ME exercises and stop varying things so much. A little tweaking/changing here or there is fine, but at this moment i have no clue what works.
    • I need to retest more often. It is important to base my DE percentages on a recent max, not something i think i could lift, months ago on a good day.
    • I need to gain some weight. I also need to take measurements and start tracking things better. I have no clue if im getting bigger or not. My weight also fluctuates more due to the carb backloading diet so it will be important to track.

    Lots to work on and a lot more to learn, good times .
    Last edited by LuNa; 03-22-2012 at 01:58 AM.

  4. #2504
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNa View Post
    [*]I did not like structuring my training in blocks. I rather adjust based on how i am feeling, i.e. if i feel beat up i might take a 3rm or a 5rm instead for a couple of weeks. I think the high volume speed work was very good, but also rather throw that in for a couple weeks when im worn out then have a fixed structure.
    That's one thing I cannot do. I find, if I give myself an opportunity to slack off in training - I will slack off. haha. Not saying that you would, just envious that you can do that I guess.

  5. #2505
    Jersey Iron Barbaccio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNa View Post
    During the last couple of weeks i realised a few things which i will need to focus on the coming weeks:[*]I did not like structuring my training in blocks. I rather adjust based on how i am feeling, i.e. if i feel beat up i might take a 3rm or a 5rm instead for a couple of weeks. I think the high volume speed work was very good, but also rather throw that in for a couple weeks when im worn out then have a fixed structure.
    I've trained both ways and you'd probably benefit from structured, but with more flexibility. It's hard to train "by feel". Most people can't do it. Way to easy to slack. A lot of the training we do is Prilpen based. It allows you to structure yourself but still have some flexibility. If you're interested, let me know and I'd be happy to explain what and how we run it.

    [*]For my squat to increase, i need to have heavy weight on my back more frequent. This will build confidence and ill get used to the feeling of heavy weight. Therefore, almost all ME Lower lifts will be back squats or Good Mornings.
    Took me a long time to realized this for myself so it's good you've caught it quick. Another great way to do this is to use a few sets of reverse band squatting to overload yourself at the top without killing your CNS at the bottom.
    [*]My bench has not increased at all the last weeks, maybe months. I thought my weakness was my back, but i can row close to, or even more, then i can bench. My OH press has always been weak and has not increased since my first year, so i will be including a lot more shoulder pressing.
    Instead of just changing a movement, figure out WHERE you're stalling. That will tell you what you need to work on. Are you stalling off the chest? Mid-press? Lockout? Figuring that out will tell you what muscles are failing you and allow you to choose a plan of attack for fixing it.

    [*]I am going to pick 3-4 ME exercises and stop varying things so much. A little tweaking/changing here or there is fine, but at this moment i have no clue what works.
    Another great idea! I ran something like this about a year ago. I used Floor Press/Bench/1-Board/2-Board. I learned a ton. Each inch gave me 20lbs. I was hitting 455/475/495/525. So now I can pretty much figure out where my bench is at using any of those lifts.

    [*]I need to retest more often. It is important to base my DE percentages on a recent max, not something i think i could lift, months ago on a good day.
    I'd look to train at least 8 weeks before each retest. That should give you enough time to make some gains. Also, your idea about about cutting down the amount of different movements and focusing on a few should, like I said, help you start to be able to judge where you're at in certain lifts just based on partial movements like a board press, box squat, or rack pull.

    [*]I need to gain some weight. I also need to take measurements and start tracking things better. I have no clue if im getting bigger or not. My weight also fluctuates more due to the carb backloading diet so it will be important to track.
    Are you training strictly for size? If you are then yes, I'd suggest getting measurements and setting some specific goals. If you're training for strength forget the measurements, get your weight down and set specific goals for that instead. You don't always have to gain size to gain strength.

    You've got some great ideas here LUNA. I look forward to seeing how you progress. If I can help at all let me know!

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  6. #2506
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbaccio View Post
    I've trained both ways and you'd probably benefit from structured, but with more flexibility. It's hard to train "by feel". Most people can't do it. Way to easy to slack. A lot of the training we do is Prilpen based. It allows you to structure yourself but still have some flexibility. If you're interested, let me know and I'd be happy to explain what and how we run it.

    I am very interested to hear whatever advice someone as experienced as you could give me, so please do. I agree with your point, there needs to be a basis which is structured but allows for flexibility on the go.


    Took me a long time to realized this for myself so it's good you've caught it quick. Another great way to do this is to use a few sets of reverse band squatting to overload yourself at the top without killing your CNS at the bottom.

    I have thought about using reverse band squats, but we do not have a cage. I could attach bands at the top of rack, but the bands would pull me forward.

    Instead of just changing a movement, figure out WHERE you're stalling. That will tell you what you need to work on. Are you stalling off the chest? Mid-press? Lockout? Figuring that out will tell you what muscles are failing you and allow you to choose a plan of attack for fixing it.

    I am stalling off the chest. A big part is technical, i cant seem to keep my elbows tucked when the weight gets heavy. They flare the moment i press and i loose all power off the chest. I am not quite sure what i can do to fix this. I keep saying in my head "tuck", "tuck", "tuck" but that goes out of the window when i start thinking "damn this is heavy". I also dont have any training partners that could give me verbal cues.

    Another great idea! I ran something like this about a year ago. I used Floor Press/Bench/1-Board/2-Board. I learned a ton. Each inch gave me 20lbs. I was hitting 455/475/495/525. So now I can pretty much figure out where my bench is at using any of those lifts.

    Great to see that you have used the same and got good results.

    I'd look to train at least 8 weeks before each retest. That should give you enough time to make some gains. Also, your idea about about cutting down the amount of different movements and focusing on a few should, like I said, help you start to be able to judge where you're at in certain lifts just based on partial movements like a board press, box squat, or rack pull.

    8 weeks sounds good.


    Are you training strictly for size? If you are then yes, I'd suggest getting measurements and setting some specific goals. If you're training for strength forget the measurements, get your weight down and set specific goals for that instead. You don't always have to gain size to gain strength.

    Not strictly for size, but i am currently not happy with the size where i am at. Thats why there is still a focus on getting bigger.

    You've got some great ideas here LUNA. I look forward to seeing how you progress. If I can help at all let me know!
    I really appreciate someone with your experience coming in here and giving some advice/information. I will include the advice and see where i am at in 8 weeks. Thanks a lot.

  7. #2507
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rileigh View Post
    That's one thing I cannot do. I find, if I give myself an opportunity to slack off in training - I will slack off. haha. Not saying that you would, just envious that you can do that I guess.
    I didnt mean it perse as not having a base at all. I would still use the standard template of ME/DE/RE, however i wouldnt say ill do 3 weeks of 5rm/3rm, then 3 weeks of 1RM etc. I find that i want to be able to determine whether i hit a single or a triple.

    I still have a long way to go before i would be able to be that flexible .

  8. #2508
    Moderator Brian Hopper's Avatar
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    Luna, my advice...............listen to Tone!!!
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  9. #2509
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Hopper View Post
    Luna, my advice...............listen to Tone!!!
    I seen the results you got at your meet with Tone's help, so im all ears!

  10. #2510
    Jersey Iron Barbaccio's Avatar
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    Here's a copy of Prilepins Table:

    Range Reps Optimal Total
    <70% 3-6 24 18-30
    70-79% 3-6 18 12-24
    80-89% 2-4 15 10-20
    90%+ 1-2 7 4-10

    Notice the ranges? These are what you base your training off of depending upon if it's a good, bad, or average day.

    For example, supposed this week you're due for 85% @ 5 sets of 3. But when you get there everything feels light! You could change 5x3 to 3x5! Or 4x5, or 6x3. If you're having a bad day you could pull back to 3x3 or 4x3 or 5x2. It allows you to adjust but still ensure you're getting the amount of work in necessary to benefit you. It will also allow you to see and test progress. If you get 3x2@90% but 8 weeks later the weight feels good and you go 90%@2x3 you know you've gotten a little stronger!

    2) I understand the problem you've got with the bands. I've had the same issues. That sucks.

    3) Weak off the chest there are several things you can do and I'll also tell you how to start fixing your elbows.
    As far as being weak off the chest, you can work deep dumbbells, you bench in a rack and start the bar on your chest forcing you to push from a dead stop. Floor Press is another thing that would help off the chest.
    As for your elbows, get a light or mini band. twist it around your elbows twice and bench like that. The band will keep pulling your elbows in. Get some video of your bench if you can!

    4) I saw very good results with that cycle. Just make sure you take a down week after the rotation so you don't burn out going heavy like that every week.

    5) Focus on your strength and the size will come. The accessory work is where you'll work to add the size. Keep the big lifts in the ranges above and you'll get the strength you want. Then work for your size with the smaller movements.

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  11. #2511
    WBB Team Captain Coke's Avatar
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    Tremendous output Luna, killer approach going on these days!

  12. #2512
    Goals (kg) 272.5/165/305 HJP's Avatar
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    Great advice. Nice training too Luna! Big things to come
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  13. #2513
    LuNa
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    ME Upper 03-23-2012

    Warm up stuff

    Dead stop bench, one inch from chest, thumbs from smooth
    3x5xbar
    2x5x30kg (65lbs)
    5x40kg (90lbs)
    5x45kg (100lbs)
    3x55kg (120lbs)
    2x65kg (145lbs)
    1x72.5kg (160lbs)
    1x80kg (175lbs)
    1x85kg (185lbs)
    1x90kg (200lbs) <- goal for the day, but smoked it
    1x95kg (210lbs) <- smoked
    1x100kg (225lbs) <- smoked, decided to stop

    Decided to put Tone's advice into work straight away. The dead stop presses are awesome because i dont have to worry about my spotter. Everything flew up, even the 225lbs. Its a little slow the first inch or so but then really speeds up. Im sure i could have gotten another 10lbs or so but i didnt want to fail the first time round. I also made a slight change to my form and i got a lot more leg drive. Will be great to see how it feels when doing DE work.

    Zydrunas Press
    8xbar
    6x30kg (65lbs)
    6x40kg (90lbs)
    8x50kg (110lbs)

    Facepulls
    5x8x60kg (135lbs), 20 seconds rest between sets

    DB Hammer Curls SS Band pushdowns
    8x14's (32's) | 20xsmall
    8x18's (40's) | 20xsmall
    8x22's (48's) | 20xsmall

    Arms are pumped brah!

    Feeling awesome.

  14. #2514
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbaccio View Post
    Here's a copy of Prilepins Table:

    Range Reps Optimal Total
    <70% 3-6 24 18-30
    70-79% 3-6 18 12-24
    80-89% 2-4 15 10-20
    90%+ 1-2 7 4-10

    Notice the ranges? These are what you base your training off of depending upon if it's a good, bad, or average day.

    For example, supposed this week you're due for 85% @ 5 sets of 3. But when you get there everything feels light! You could change 5x3 to 3x5! Or 4x5, or 6x3. If you're having a bad day you could pull back to 3x3 or 4x3 or 5x2. It allows you to adjust but still ensure you're getting the amount of work in necessary to benefit you. It will also allow you to see and test progress. If you get 3x2@90% but 8 weeks later the weight feels good and you go 90%@2x3 you know you've gotten a little stronger!

    That makes a lot of sense. Going to print that table and put it in my logbook that i bring with me to the gym.

    2) I understand the problem you've got with the bands. I've had the same issues. That sucks.

    3) Weak off the chest there are several things you can do and I'll also tell you how to start fixing your elbows.
    As far as being weak off the chest, you can work deep dumbbells, you bench in a rack and start the bar on your chest forcing you to push from a dead stop. Floor Press is another thing that would help off the chest.
    As for your elbows, get a light or mini band. twist it around your elbows twice and bench like that. The band will keep pulling your elbows in. Get some video of your bench if you can!

    I included the dead stop presses and loved them. I have always done DB work so those will stay in. Going to use the bands around my elbows on my next DE day. I have put up some video before, but will get a new one this Sunday.

    4) I saw very good results with that cycle. Just make sure you take a down week after the rotation so you don't burn out going heavy like that every week.

    [/b]Yep, was planning on taking a deload after every cycle, retest and go again.

    5) Focus on your strength and the size will come. The accessory work is where you'll work to add the size. Keep the big lifts in the ranges above and you'll get the strength you want. Then work for your size with the smaller movements.

    That sounds great, will do.
    Thanks again for the advice Tone. I really appreciate it.

  15. #2515
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coke View Post
    Tremendous output Luna, killer approach going on these days!
    Quote Originally Posted by HJP View Post
    Great advice. Nice training too Luna! Big things to come
    Thanks guys. I just need to set some better goals now and work to smash them.

  16. #2516
    Moderator Brian Hopper's Avatar
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    My advice with the dead presses, is build up slow. Don't be in a hurry trying to lift the most you can. I've seen a few lifters get shoulder problems from doing these. I'm not saying you will, im saying just take your time building up. I also read an article that Josh Bryant wrote and he says to do about 6-8 singles. When I get on a computer I'll post a link to the article.
    My Training Log
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  17. #2517
    Jersey Iron Barbaccio's Avatar
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    ^ Agreed. Instead of going with 3 singles with 200/210/225 (A total of 635) set the weight at about 215 or 220 and do 4-5 singles (A total of 880 even if you only do 4 reps!). That's a 200lb difference in the amount of volume you've done with that small change! That being said, today was a big step forward. Glad to see the 225 flew up. That makes it sound like the problem with you bench might just be your elbows/technique and not a strength issue. That's GREAT news because technique can be fixed. Strength takes longer to build! Workout looked good overall LuNa!

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  18. #2518
    Moderator Brian Hopper's Avatar
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    Here is an article I found by Josh Bryant:
    Bring your Bench Press Alive with the Dead Bench
    My Training Log
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    *************************
    Best geared meet @ 242
    1030SQ, 640BP, 685DL and 2355 total
    Best raw meet w/sleeves @ 242
    665SQ, 440BP, 727DL and 1815 total
    Best raw meet w/sleeves @ 275
    700SQ, 452BP, 722DL and 1874 total

    *************************
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  19. #2519
    WBB Team Captain Coke's Avatar
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    Way to tweak things and make adjustments as needed, props overall in here.

  20. #2520
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Hopper View Post
    My advice with the dead presses, is build up slow. Don't be in a hurry trying to lift the most you can. I've seen a few lifters get shoulder problems from doing these. I'm not saying you will, im saying just take your time building up. I also read an article that Josh Bryant wrote and he says to do about 6-8 singles. When I get on a computer I'll post a link to the article.
    I wasnt sure which to go for, 1RM, 3RM or even a 5RM becaue you have mentioned before that they can be a little harsh on the shoulders. I also found that Josh Bryant article and quickly read through it before i left for the gym. He mentioned only going for singles, but one could do 6-8 singles if more volume was required. Ill go for the more volume option next time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbaccio View Post
    ^ Agreed. Instead of going with 3 singles with 200/210/225 (A total of 635) set the weight at about 215 or 220 and do 4-5 singles (A total of 880 even if you only do 4 reps!). That's a 200lb difference in the amount of volume you've done with that small change! That being said, today was a big step forward. Glad to see the 225 flew up. That makes it sound like the problem with you bench might just be your elbows/technique and not a strength issue. That's GREAT news because technique can be fixed. Strength takes longer to build! Workout looked good overall LuNa!
    Will go for a multiple singles the next time it comes around. Focus now is on fixing the elbow issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Hopper View Post
    Here is an article I found by Josh Bryant:
    Bring your Bench Press Alive with the Dead Bench
    Thanks Brian!

  21. #2521
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coke View Post
    Way to tweak things and make adjustments as needed, props overall in here.
    Thanks Coke. A little tweaking can go a long way.

  22. #2522
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    Sounds like your making some really good changes. Hope to see some big gains soon

  23. #2523
    LuNa
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    DE Lower 03-25-2012

    Warm up stuff

    Kneeling jumps
    2x3xBW
    2xBW+broom <- fell on my face on the 3rd rep

    Squats, parallel box
    4x5xbar <- add chocked smalls
    2x5xbar
    2x40kg (90lbs)
    2x2x60kg (135lbs)
    2x70kg (155lbs) <- add belt, one notch loose
    2x80kg (175lbs)
    10x2x90kg (200lbs) <- Speed was decent, bands were pretty tough today though.

    Deads
    3x1x60kg (135lbs)
    2x1x80kg (175lbs)
    3x1x100kg (225lbs)
    1x110kg (245lbs)
    5x1x120kg (265lbs) <- sumo, loose belt
    3x1x120kg (265lbs) <- conv, slower than the sumo ones, sumo felt better today

    Pull throughs
    5x20x50kg (110lbs)

    This felt like death. All reps were done explosively, 20 secs between sets.

    SL Sit ups
    10xBW
    10xBW+10kg (22lbs)

    My abs keep cramping up on these, they get hit pretty hard.

    Band pulldowns
    2x10xsmall, each side

    Backloaded with unlimited sushi buffet.

  24. #2524
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rileigh View Post
    Sounds like your making some really good changes. Hope to see some big gains soon
    Me too .

  25. #2525
    Senior Member GazzyG's Avatar
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    Really great advice you're getting in here, Luna! Great progress being made!
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