The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Wannabebig Member
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    standing db shoulder press v should press w/bb

    In terms of the target muscles how do standing db shoulder press differ from should press w/bb? Which is the better compound work out (I'm assuming bb) and the better w/o strictly for shoulders?
    Thanks

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  3. #2
    Must...work...out... nockits's Avatar
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    I think DB might be better, but I've only ever done DB shoulder press while seated. With dumbbells, you have to focus on stabilizing as well as lifting, and I think they target your shoulders better than BB.
    Check out my Journal!

    Quote Originally Posted by Skalami View Post
    I just give the worked on muscle group tough riddles before my workouts... or sometimes I'll tell them we're going to the park and then go to the gym, or visa versa. They start to catch on so you have to tell the truth every so often.
    *While on the topic of muscle confusion, and how often a routine needs to be changed.*

  4. #3
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    barbell you can go heavier usually

    I usually warm up with lighter DBs and then switch to barbell for one more warmup and then one max effort set of 8-10.
    Last edited by samadhi_smiles; 06-06-2009 at 07:11 AM.

  5. #4
    Moderator joey54's Avatar
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    With the barbell you can move more weight and probably progress in strength with the movement over a longer period of time. What does that tell you?

  6. #5
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    I would think that BB is the better overall workout and DB is marginally better for shoulders. Just a guess though.

  7. #6
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    What does it matter? They're both good and you should work on getting extremely strong on both. That's much more important than finding the "best" exercise for each specific bodypart.

  8. #7
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    Thanks for all the responses

    Joey, I'm not sure what it tells me, I'm able to cheat more, I use more of the larger muscles? Not being a jerk, just don't get what you're getting at.

    Brad, I'm doing a pre-made SS program that includes the push press, my previous program that wasn't a pre-made included db should presses Really enjoy the push press, but I feel like my shoulders aren't working as hard. I just wanted to understand the trade-off. Not going to change the program, jut want to know the difference.

    Thanks

  9. #8
    Wannabebig Member tennisrox4's Avatar
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    I do them in the smith machine.
    Height:6ft 2in

    Stats:
    working on it

  10. #9
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tennisrox4 View Post
    I do them in the smith machine.
    I would only use a smith machine for pullups or a towell rack.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

    Progress pics of a cut using bodyweight only movements http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/sho...45#post2405745

    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by knowsam View Post
    Brad, I'm doing a pre-made SS program that includes the push press, my previous program that wasn't a pre-made included db should presses Really enjoy the push press, but I feel like my shoulders aren't working as hard. I just wanted to understand the trade-off. Not going to change the program, jut want to know the difference.

    Thanks
    Well the difference between BB militaries and DB militaries is the same difference that exists between BB's and DB's in any lift. DBs require more stabilization, which means you typically use less weight, but they tend to put more emphasis on the target muscle group (e.g., they're better for isolation). Barbells let you lift more weight and recruit more overall musculature. And it tends to be easier to train progressively using barbells b/c you can load 2.5 lb plates on each side to allow for 5 lb jumps, and you can even buy microplates and add 1.25 lbs to each side,etc, to allow for 2.5 lb jumps. Dumbbells aren't as flexible in that regard.

    The difference between PUSH PRESS and DB or even BB MILITARY press is quite different though. Push Press is an entirely different lift, and you can do it with dumbbells or barbells. It's apples and oranges to a military press. It's a power movement. It's an explosive lift that starts with leg drive. Leg drive takes you past your sticking point, and you then lock it out with triceps, shoulders, and upper back. You typically don't lower it slowly so there's no negative component. Because it's an explosive power lift, you typically do low reps, such as singles, doubles, or triples.

  12. #11
    A.K.A Goodwinner Goodwinm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tennisrox4 View Post
    I do them in the smith machine.


    good joke
    My Journal

    Squat: 150kg (330lbs) Raw- 31.01.14
    Deadlift: 180kg x 3 (396lbs) Raw - 14.12.13
    Bench: 110kg (242lbs) Raw - 29.01.14
    Barbell Military Press: 85kg (187lbs) Raw- 31.01.14
    Barbell Push Press: 100kg (220lbs) Raw- 31.01.14

  13. #12
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    Starting Strength is OH press not Push Press.

  14. #13
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    Thanks for all the responses, Samadhi, I'm doing the practical progrom routine, it has 1 or 2 days of press on alternating weeks.
    I find I'm using my legs to get the bar started, I'm trying to use hips instead. I say I'm doing what is "comfortable" but I'm concerned I'm cheating with the legs/hips.

  15. #14
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    well you're not 'cheating' (there are no rules bro this is YOUR hobby and you're not competing I take it).

    There's a video online of Mark Rippetoe teaching OH press, he does have a little 'back drive' in it to get the initial movement started. There is no leg drive though. Leg drive takes away tension from the anterior deltoids (you still get it on the negative portion of the lift though). I actually prefer push press since I can lift more weights and if I can control the weight on the negative adequately I think I will grow faster than less weight with overhead press. But, if you want to do SS to a 'T' then I would say back the weight down and start over (this is common practice with SS trainers) and start using exact form.

    Or keep doing push press...its a great lift!

  16. #15
    Wannabebig Member tennisrox4's Avatar
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    what's wrong with doing shoulder press in the smith machine?
    Height:6ft 2in

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    working on it

  17. #16
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    I'd say once you get to a certain point with shoulder pressing and you're trying to work until failure, then smith machine is fine. But for somebody just starting out in the lift, I think its more detrimental than beneficial (since it restricts the planes of motion and doesn't work stabilizers thus promoting strength imbalances).

  18. #17
    Senior Member tom183's Avatar
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    ^--It locks your ROM into the 'straight up and down' of the smith machine. This promotes use of the prime movers and minimises the use of stabiliser muscles.

  19. #18
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    but if you're trying to OH press 285 14 times until muscular failure, it may be smart to do this on a smith machine. Since 285 falling on your head would probably kill/paralyze you.

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