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Thread: I sometimes wonder if lifting/eating "big" really is over rated at times..

  1. #1
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    I sometimes wonder if lifting/eating "big" really is over rated at times..

    I expected to be blasted here but hear me out first.


    So, for a body builder looking to gain good quality weight and size must, eat big, lift big.....right?

    A big majoirty of people who train want to be of a modest size and not arnold style yet even that is quite a hard grind in achieving with most people with a LOT of work involved along with the correct food.


    However, why is it there are many of people one I know very well (He's a Polish worker who works in England doing plastering) He is not interested in body building and doesn't do any fitness or workout and I'd say he eats like a standard human being would. Three meals a day at most.

    He stands at 5ft10" in height and weighs around 220lb/s of GOOD weight. When I say good weight, I mean good weight. He has huge shoulders,huge forearms and upper body etc. To be honest, he looks like a Syvester Stallone back in his hay day in terms of size and how ripped his body is. He doesn't walk around showing it off though, you can just see it through his t-shirt or vest depending on how hot it is. Now, this guy doesn't ever train and works long hours to send money home to Poland, he eats all cheap foods, works 12hours a day, 6 and sometimes even 7days a week and has been doing this for 2 years.. Like I say, he is solid, looks very well but he really doesn't eat much, I've seen him eat a sandwich a dinner time and that's it, till he goes home and eats something. I'd be surprised if he ate more than 2500 calories per day and god knows what he burns off in a day too.

    I know plastering is a very hard job and you have to be physically strong to do it all day long plastering walls/celinigs etc but I wonder, for someone to have such a good looking body and eat so little and the weight he lifts not really increasing ever..how does he have such a body and not dwindle in to nothing?

    This can't be genetics, not possible so I wonder if sometimes eating 5000+ calories a day and training with heavy weights is all what it's supposed to be?

    If I came on here and said "ok, my regime is going to be shoulders/chinups/pullups on a 3 meal a day diet and train for 10hours a day 6 days a week to be like Syvestor stallone" you would no doubt all laugh but I wonder if it is actually possible (clearly it is by the way) then what the hell is going on with this bloke in all honestly?

    Interested in peoples thoughts on manual labor workers and the amount of lifting/pulling they do in 12hour shifts and eating quite little to then have a great shape is all about? If this was even contemplated in being achieved on a poor diet with all that lifting (to be honest the lifting isnt that big either, not like benching 100kg or squatting 300kg) people would be outraged yet clearly it is possible in a sense.. that you can actually build a very good figure with a standard "normal" person diet, working in many labour and be in quite good shape indeed..
    Last edited by skinnyboyo; 07-10-2011 at 06:33 AM.

  2. #2
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skinnyboyo View Post
    This can't be genetics, not possible so I wonder if sometimes eating 5000+ calories a day and training with heavy weights is all what it's supposed to be?.
    It IS genetics. If it wasn't genetics, then every single guy that did the exact same thing as him would look exactly like him. Think about it, you said this ONE GUY has this body, you didn't say the WHOLE CREW has this body. Go to any work site and you'll see big strong guys, little skinny guys, and everything in-between.
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    Strongman Tom Mutaffis's Avatar
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    Weight training and bodybuilding are a gradual process, and once you get to a certain point it is fairly easy to maintain your gains. Perhaps the gentleman who you are talking about has a background in weight training and that is how he initially built his physique - but now does not have time/energy to train.

    Genetics are always going to be a factor and each individual responds differently to diet, training, etc.

    Some people need to eat 7,000 calories/day in order to put on size whereas others might only need to eat 2,500/day to maintain 200+ lbs.
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    "Eating big" and "Lifting big" are simple ways of saying something that is actually quite scientific. If you want to build muscle mass, you must eat above maintenance calories, and you must lift heavy weights. Otherwise it's purely genetics. Purely. I'm sure the man your talking about has gained some strength from his occupation, but like Off Road said, if he wasn't genetically inclined, then everyone with that job who ate the same amount of food would look like Sylvester Stalone.
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    House Lannister
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    Quote Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
    It IS genetics. If it wasn't genetics, then every single guy that did the exact same thing as him would look exactly like him. Think about it, you said this ONE GUY has this body, you didn't say the WHOLE CREW has this body. Go to any work site and you'll see big strong guys, little skinny guys, and everything in-between.
    This.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
    It IS genetics. If it wasn't genetics, then every single guy that did the exact same thing as him would look exactly like him. Think about it, you said this ONE GUY has this body, you didn't say the WHOLE CREW has this body. Go to any work site and you'll see big strong guys, little skinny guys, and everything in-between.
    Exactly. It IS genetics. I worked as a manual labourer for a while and lost a lot of weight even though I was having a cooked breakfast most days and eating much bigger lunches than some of the other guys. A couple of guys I worked with were quite lean and a couple were typical beer-belly types. We all worked about as hard as each other yet had completely different physiques and calorie intakes.

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    OVERCOME krazylarry's Avatar
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    You answered your own question when you said Polish, those are some hearty MOFO's.
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    What everyone else said. Also there is something to be said about high frequency activity and 'preparedeness'. Your friend may have built the ability to survive his job with that amount of calories over many years. In addition, manual laborers avoid muscular failure and cumulative fatigue at all costs (even if they dont know it). If they get to tired or injured, they cant work. Im sure for every 1 laborer like your friend, there are 5-10 "out of shape" individuals.

    Another thing to consider, is that what he's doing now is working just perfect for his life right now. If he were to eat more, he might be fat. If he were to get injured, he might get fat. Lastly, since he probably has good genetics, he may actually be considred 'small' compared to his potential. If he were train with heavy weights and eat adequately he might be the next Arnold and not even know it.

    The processes for getting big and lean are pretty much the same fore everyone regardless of genetics. Its just that you have to compare yourself to yourself, and not to others.

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    Moderator joey54's Avatar
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    This thread happens about 1 time per year. Good answers guys.


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    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    "Eating big", if that means downing 5,000+ calories a day and measuring out eight different meals a day, IS overrated for most people. They scientifically calibrate precisely what macronutrients they need to put into their bodies at what times to result in them.... getting fat and looking like crap.

    I'd check that 2500 calorie figure, since you don't know what he's taking in when he's not around you, but otherwise, here's something to take away from this guy:

    -He has consistency.

    Period, full stop. He's working his body hard, and doing it regularly. Nothing remotely complicated about it. Screw explanations about "genetics" and his history. If you decide to go in to the gym, do solid workouts four or five days a week, push yourself hard, and eat enough calories to recover adequately and even slowly (ever so slowly), gain some weight, you'll look pretty fantastic in eight or nine years.

    Too many people get impatient, switch routines every few months, take time off here or there because they're lazy, let their form go to shit because they insist they want to bench more than their buddies, do ridiculous things like bulk till they're fat then cut till they're back where they started. Don't get caught up in the latest fad workouts, don't stress about the mirror, don't stress about your poundages, don't stress about your diet. Just kick butt, and kick it with regularity.
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    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    It doesn't take even close to 8-9 years to see very significant results if one trains properly and eats in such a fashion as to provide sufficient fuel for growth. More like 1-2.


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    Quote Originally Posted by chris mason View Post
    It doesn't take even close to 8-9 years to see very significant results if one trains properly and eats in such a fashion as to provide sufficient fuel for growth. More like 1-2.
    It depends what you mean by "significant results". If you start out as a skinny-fat 150lbs, you shouldn't expect to be lean over 200lbs in 1-2 years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Fanelli View Post
    It depends what you mean by "significant results". If you start out as a skinny-fat 150lbs, you shouldn't expect to be lean over 200lbs in 1-2 years.

    That's not true at all. I was a skinny fat 175-180 and now I'm a significantly lower bodyfat percentage 225. That was just under 2 years ago.
    Starting weight:177
    Weight:223
    Height:6'1"
    Starting bench:135x3
    Bench:225x9/270x2
    Starting squat:185x3
    Squat:405x1
    Starting deadlift:250x1
    Deadlift:405x1
    1 year and 6 months of hardwork, bitchezzz

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    Quote Originally Posted by Counterweight View Post
    That's not true at all. I was a skinny fat 175-180 and now I'm a significantly lower bodyfat percentage 225. That was just under 2 years ago.
    Congratulations, you are either very tall or have good genetics.

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    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Fanelli View Post
    It depends what you mean by "significant results". If you start out as a skinny-fat 150lbs, you shouldn't expect to be lean over 200lbs in 1-2 years.
    I would think a skinny fat 150 lbs person would consider say 180 lbs and muscular to be quite significant...

    Why even post that? It is just goofy.

    The POINT is that you can essentially max out your physical potential for natural muscle growth, assuming you are an adult, within a year or two. I have seen it happen over and over. Strength is another topic all together.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Fanelli View Post
    Congratulations, you are either very tall or have good genetics.
    I'm about 6'1" and have mediocre genetics at best. So much of it is based on work ethic. I see so many people say "Oh, my genetics won't let me get that jacked, oh my leverages aren't right". Sometimes people just need to shut the hell up and lift. You end up wasting time thinking that you could be using for lifting.

    Sounds like a myopic approach to lifting, but everyone I know who has this mentality has made gains far surpassing those who think about everything and calculate their volume so they know they're not 'over-training'. Basically it's nut up or shut up, don't try and be a hardass and lift something that's going to crush you, but nothing will replace consistent hard-work. So many people wonder why they don't gain, it's because their intensity sucks balls.
    Starting weight:177
    Weight:223
    Height:6'1"
    Starting bench:135x3
    Bench:225x9/270x2
    Starting squat:185x3
    Squat:405x1
    Starting deadlift:250x1
    Deadlift:405x1
    1 year and 6 months of hardwork, bitchezzz

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    House Lannister
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    Quote Originally Posted by Counterweight View Post
    I'm about 6'1" and have mediocre genetics at best. So much of it is based on work ethic. I see so many people say "Oh, my genetics won't let me get that jacked, oh my leverages aren't right". Sometimes people just need to shut the hell up and lift. You end up wasting time thinking that you could be using for lifting.

    Sounds like a myopic approach to lifting, but everyone I know who has this mentality has made gains far surpassing those who think about everything and calculate their volume so they know they're not 'over-training'. Basically it's nut up or shut up, don't try and be a hardass and lift something that's going to crush you, but nothing will replace consistent hard-work. So many people wonder why they don't gain, it's because their intensity sucks balls.
    Great post. 100% agree.

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    Become Unbreakable Mark!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Counterweight View Post
    I'm about 6'1" and have mediocre genetics at best. So much of it is based on work ethic. I see so many people say "Oh, my genetics won't let me get that jacked, oh my leverages aren't right". Sometimes people just need to shut the hell up and lift. You end up wasting time thinking that you could be using for lifting.

    Sounds like a myopic approach to lifting, but everyone I know who has this mentality has made gains far surpassing those who think about everything and calculate their volume so they know they're not 'over-training'. Basically it's nut up or shut up, don't try and be a hardass and lift something that's going to crush you, but nothing will replace consistent hard-work. So many people wonder why they don't gain, it's because their intensity sucks balls.
    Hell yes son. My nephew is one of those guys, always bitching and moaning because he can't make gains and wonders why. He spends a small fortune at GNC every paycheck on shitty supplements, refuses to train on a solid proven routine, and STILL have the balls to text me at 3am Sunday morning bitching about how he just can't get stronger or bigger. It's about getting your ass in the gym and busting your balls. Sure, a lot of, maybe even not a lot, but some IFBB pros are stacked with God given genetics and abilities, but these guys in there busting their fucking ass 3-4 hours a day are earning theirs. Genetics have a role to play but you play the hand your dealt. If all you're going to do is sit around moaning about not being able to do this or that because of genetics, find a hole to crawl in to. Pull yourself up by your boot straps, dust off your hat and bust your ass day in, day out, and like others have said, in a year or twos time that person looking back at you in the mirror will be completely different.
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    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Counterweight View Post
    Sometimes people just need to shut the hell up and lift. You end up wasting time thinking that you could be using for lifting.

    Basically it's nut up or shut up,

    nothing will replace consistent hard-work.
    This, that, and that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris mason View Post
    The POINT is that you can essentially max out your physical potential for natural muscle growth, assuming you are an adult, within a year or two. I have seen it happen over and over. Strength is another topic all together.
    What? Are you saying that if you were a new lifter and did everything perfectly that you wouldn't be able to get bigger without steroids after 1-2 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by greemah View Post
    What? Are you saying that if you were a new lifter and did everything perfectly that you wouldn't be able to get bigger without steroids after 1-2 years?

    The principle of diminishing returns. It would be much slower going after that time-frame.
    Starting weight:177
    Weight:223
    Height:6'1"
    Starting bench:135x3
    Bench:225x9/270x2
    Starting squat:185x3
    Squat:405x1
    Starting deadlift:250x1
    Deadlift:405x1
    1 year and 6 months of hardwork, bitchezzz

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    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greemah View Post
    What? Are you saying that if you were a new lifter and did everything perfectly that you wouldn't be able to get bigger without steroids after 1-2 years?
    This shouldn't be new news to anybody. I've said it on here about a zillion times. Start with a good, basic program, with a focus on strength progression. It will be quite obvious in a short time if you were made to be a powerlifter, a bodybuilder, or just a recreational lifter.

    Dr. Ken used to say that a guy could spend a couple of years doing nothing but a squat, a press, and a row, and with enough effort realize about 80% of their genetic potntial. There's something to chew on...
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    Wannabebig Member Hguols's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris mason View Post
    It doesn't take even close to 8-9 years to see very significant results if one trains properly and eats in such a fashion as to provide sufficient fuel for growth. More like 1-2.
    I can vouch for that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
    This shouldn't be new news to anybody. I've said it on here about a zillion times. Start with a good, basic program, with a focus on strength progression. It will be quite obvious in a short time if you were made to be a powerlifter, a bodybuilder, or just a recreational lifter.

    Dr. Ken used to say that a guy could spend a couple of years doing nothing but a squat, a press, and a row, and with enough effort realize about 80% of their genetic potntial. There's something to chew on...
    Damn that sucks, I've been lifting for 3 years and am still small.. granted, the first half of that was cutting

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