The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

It’s no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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Thread: UK RIOTS RANT!

  1. #1
    fat submariner
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    UK RIOTS RANT!

    Like Kiff said, there's no political motive to these disgusting events... this rioting and looting are not demonstrations, just criminals who want stuff but can't be arsed getting jobs so they can actually pay for it or who just want to destroy stuff that honest people have worked for!

    It's a sad reflection of what we have allowed this once great country to decline into; a society of bleeding heart liberals who have developed a whole generation who have no respect for others or the rule of law, who take no responsibility for their own actions and feel entitled to state handouts but feel no obligation to ever give anything back!

    Bring back National Service!
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  3. #2
    Skinny Feet Kiff's Avatar
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    Agree with this! Liberalism killed this country, people blame the new Tory govt but labour breed these thugs.
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  4. #3
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    Not sure that's entirely true. It's more likely the massive failings of parents, schools, social workers, and businesses in deprived areas over several generations of several different governments.

    The kids aren't all black, aren't all asian, aren't all white, they aren't even all the same age. It's too complex to just point the finger at one group and one cause.

    I think it's reflective of a wider ME ME ME culture that's been growing for years across all western countries. It's just pure idiotic selfishness, fuelled by pointless rage.

  5. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.C. View Post
    Not sure that's entirely true. It's more likely the massive failings of parents, schools, social workers, and businesses in deprived areas over several generations of several different governments.

    The kids aren't all black, aren't all asian, aren't all white, they aren't even all the same age. It's too complex to just point the finger at one group and one cause.

    I think it's reflective of a wider ME ME ME culture that's been growing for years across all western countries. It's just pure idiotic selfishness, fuelled by pointless rage.
    You're right JC, it is a mix of ages, races & backgrounds. And it has been exacerbated over years of liberal minded social workers who work to quotas set by governments more interested in headlines and votes than in fixing the problems, by a justice system hamstrung by a largely toothless police service (no longer a police force) and pathetic sentencing thanks to over crowed prisons and a litigatious society and by poor parenting with no discipline in the home or school!

    If the people arrested for these are minors then their parents should be in the dock with them. If they're adults then they should expect to take responsibility for their actions; if you can't do the time then don't do the crime was old mantra... unfortunately these thugs know the system and know that they will most probably get away with it!
    Last edited by macdaknife; 08-11-2011 at 07:16 AM.
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  6. #5
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    We have similar problems here in the States. Liberal govenment, liberal teachers, liberal parents, entitlement issues, and a poor economy.
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  7. #6
    Tap, Rack, Bacon ncsuLuke's Avatar
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    It is all about entitlement issues, these kids feel entitled to take whatever they want and damage whatever they want because they were not brought up in a way that promoted personal responsibility. I guarantee if they had to actually work for the food on their plates they would learn to respect others things and wouldn't be out rioting like this. If you are brought up in a way that things are handed to you and you are never asked for anything in return it breeds this way of living where you do not appreciate the things you have and you do not respect others.

    I have a feeling we will see something similar happen over here before too long but it will be quite different since shop owners and whatnot can protect their livelihood with firearms here (in most places at least).

  8. #7
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    You guys are looking way too deeply into it. It's not that they have entitlement issues, it's not the fault of "liberalism", it's not about a lack of personal responsibility.

    They're just assholes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ncsuLuke View Post
    I have a feeling we will see something similar happen over here before too long but it will be quite different since shop owners and whatnot can protect their livelihood with firearms here (in most places at least).
    If guns weren't so rare in the UK, things would have been a LOT worse. I count it as a blessing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Belial View Post
    You guys are looking way too deeply into it. It's not that they have entitlement issues, it's not the fault of "liberalism", it's not about a lack of personal responsibility.

    They're just assholes.
    True, but why did they all unite on one weekend? And what makes them be an asshole? It's like an argument I had with some overly-sympathetic people about calling them "thugs". It's like yeah I get it, they're downtrodden kids with poor role-models, no father figures and poor education - but they're still "thugs". Let's not be afraid to call them what they are... and then we'll figure out why.

  10. #9
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.C. View Post

    True, but why did they all unite on one weekend? And what makes them be an asshole? It's like an argument I had with some overly-sympathetic people about calling them "thugs". It's like yeah I get it, they're downtrodden kids with poor role-models, no father figures and poor education - but they're still "thugs". Let's not be afraid to call them what they are... and then we'll figure out why.
    Because everyone else was doing it... as good a time as any to go trash things and steal stuff with limited consequences.

    What makes them assholes? ..really? I think the mistake is looking for any blanket cause.
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  11. #10
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Trust me, as an educator and a conservative, I take a ton of crap at work for not fitting into the "agenda."
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  12. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belial View Post
    Because everyone else was doing it... as good a time as any to go trash things and steal stuff with limited consequences.

    What makes them assholes? ..really? I think the mistake is looking for any blanket cause.
    So your answer is what, round up the bottom 15% of our schools and chuck them on an island somewhere? Normally I wouldn't care and I just accept that some people are twats, but I don't want it to keep happening. Writing off a fairly large portion of our youth doesn't seem a very productive thing to do.

    Also they smashed in my library and I couldn't return a book on Tuesday night. That was my human cost. I might get a late fee. True story.
    Last edited by J.C.; 08-11-2011 at 08:16 AM.

  13. #12
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    never been so embarrassed to be British. At lot of this comes from poor parenting who simply dont care, theres been numerous 11 year olds arrested, what are even 11 year olds doing out on town centres at that time of night, wheres the common sense and responsibility of the parents, disgusting.

    It was even reported on the news that one kid looted a shop and phoned his mam to come pick the stuff up and she turned up in a people carrier and filled up the car, total disgrace.

    Lets follow the middle east and chop thieves hands off, that will make them think twice.
    Last edited by geordie1986; 08-11-2011 at 09:23 AM.
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  14. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.C. View Post
    If guns weren't so rare in the UK, things would have been a LOT worse. I count it as a blessing.
    Yea, I'm sure the guy who was forced to strip down in the street thinks things could get a lot worse...These animals riot because there is no accountability. Smoke a dozen or so of them and their mindset may change just a bit. And yes, for the record I am implying that my property is worth the life of an individual that wants to take it.

    Fuck, fight, or hold the light.

  15. #14
    Tap, Rack, Bacon ncsuLuke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chubrock View Post
    Yea, I'm sure the guy who was forced to strip down in the street thinks things could get a lot worse...These animals riot because there is no accountability. Smoke a dozen or so of them and their mindset may change just a bit. And yes, for the record I am implying that my property is worth the life of an individual that wants to take it.
    +1

    Notice the only major riots in the US that I can remember are in places where they have strict gun laws (see the LA riots). Come down to Texas where you can defend your property with deadly force and see if a bunch of punks try to loot and burn a bunch of stores. There would be a Remington 870 shoved up their ass in no time and that would be the end of that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ncsuLuke View Post
    +1

    Notice the only major riots in the US that I can remember are in places where they have strict gun laws (see the LA riots). Come down to Texas where you can defend your property with deadly force and see if a bunch of punks try to loot and burn a bunch of stores. There would be a Remington 870 shoved up their ass in no time and that would be the end of that.
    Sigh.

    I don't want this to turn into a debate about gun crime, because they go nowhere, but just to try and stop this before it starts here are some statistics I got

    UK
    Shootings accounted for 39 homicides in 2008/09
    If you say that the population of England and Wales is approximately 55 million that makes the number of gun murders per 100,000 people around or less than 0.1.
    source: http://rds.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs10/hosb0110.pdf

    Texas
    Total gun-related murders: 862
    Gun murders per 100 000: 3.49
    Fire-arms robberies per 100 000 77.1
    Fire-arms assaults per 100 000 71.0
    source: http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/index.html

    3.49/0.1 = 34.9. There are 34.9 times as many gun murders per 100 000 people in Texas compared to the UK as a whole. There are also a staggeringly high number of gun related robberies, unlike you suggest in your post. So workin real well I see...


    Yes guns are a deterrent but who else do you think is most likely to have a gun? Criminals. Gang culture shows pretty conclusively they don't care about owning guns, aren't afraid to use them, and do use guns in crimes - even if shopkeepers own them too.

    The last thing you want is a riot where angry people have guns. It's the difference between an embarrassment and a massacre.

  17. #16
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.C. View Post
    Yes guns are a deterrent but who else do you think is most likely to have a gun? Criminals. Gang culture shows pretty conclusively they don't care about owning guns, aren't afraid to use them, and do use guns in crimes - even if shopkeepers own them too.

    The last thing you want is a riot where angry people have guns. It's the difference between an embarrassment and a massacre.
    More of that liberal thinking. You started to make a decent [centered] argument but ended up swinging way to the left.
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  18. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
    More of that liberal thinking. You started to make a decent [centered] argument but ended up swinging way to the left.
    I swing waayyyy to the left on social issues, but almost always agree with the right on gun control. The reason being is that I highly doubt the douchebags runnin' around with Glocks and shooting up towns are paying for those guns at a local sporting goods store. Most likely, they are purchasing these weapons illegally from an arms dealer in some shit area of town.

    I always felt that gun legislation hurt those who would use firearms responsibly, either for hunting, sporting use, or self defense. I like what I've seen/read (which isn't much) about the process of purchasing a firearm with the current laws, but I don't want to see it taken any further.

    Your friendly neighborhood domestic terrorist isn't purchasing a Beretta shotgun from Gander Mountain. He won't pass the background check. He's buying an Armalite from your friendly neighborhood arms dealer.
    Last edited by chevelle2291; 08-11-2011 at 12:55 PM.

  19. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by chevelle2291 View Post
    I swing waayyyy to the left on social issues, but almost always agree with the right on gun control.
    I'm the same. lean way left on a lot of stuff but gun control im just about as far right as you can be.

    In regards to rioting though people should read up on "group think" or group mentality. Normal people can end up doing some weird/crazy stuff when they get together in large groups like this. One guy starts looting and the herd just follows.

    And like belial said, less to do about liberalism. More to do about people being assholes.

  20. #19
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    There is a growing firearms problem within the gang culture in UK cities (despite us living in a supposed gun free society) and I think that's just an exageration of the "ME, ME, ME!" attitude mentioned before; where does that sense of entitlement and lack of responsibilty come from?

    The riots around London and across the UK were not organised events synchronised by some master protestor... they were criminals that took advantage when they realised the police were tied up elsewhere! It's nice to see communities banding together to protect their homes, businesses and possessions (even though it has cost some of them their lives unfortunately!).
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    Over 100 000 people sign an online petition demanding rioters lose all benefits.

    House of commons to debate the issue. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-14474429

    LOL

  22. #21
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    Australia is way to soft on people too........Police do not get much respect and teachers/parents have no rights.

    All the scum from other countries are moving here to take advantage of this and we are letting them.......pleased I was born in 1980 so I lived when people actually respected their elders etc.

    This ME ME ME generation pisses me off no end!!

    May have just gone off track then.
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  23. #22
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  24. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by thecityalive View Post


    All I have to say.
    I'm not picking up what you're putting down. The character in that movie was railing against governmental control and the thugs that did their dirty work.

    The pieces of shit in these riots are just looking to take from those that can't defend themselves.

    Fuck, fight, or hold the light.

  25. #24
    Who me? Chubrock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.C. View Post
    Sigh.

    I don't want this to turn into a debate about gun crime, because they go nowhere, but just to try and stop this before it starts here are some statistics I got

    Yes guns are a deterrent but who else do you think is most likely to have a gun? Criminals. Gang culture shows pretty conclusively they don't care about owning guns, aren't afraid to use them, and do use guns in crimes - even if shopkeepers own them too.

    The last thing you want is a riot where angry people have guns. It's the difference between an embarrassment and a massacre.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/2656875.stm

    It's the difference between being able to protect yourself and your family without having to live in fear and finding yourself degraded, humiliated, and naked in the street.

    If a group of thugs approached me, assaulted me to the point I'm bleeding, and I shot one in the face, do you really believe his friends are going to be as quick to jump the next person? Accountability. Currently in London, there is none. Your gov't has handcuffed your police force to the point that they won't allow water cannons or crowd dispersal tools. When you want to get serious about ending these riots, take the restraints off your LEOs and let em start cracking heads, or better yet allow the population the means to protect themselves...



    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18043018

    "Over the last 2 decades firearms legislation has become more restrictive.....During the same period the use of firearms as a method of homicide increased in England and Wales with handguns, the most common weapon. "



    "When owning guns is criminal, only criminals will own guns."

    Fuck, fight, or hold the light.

  26. #25
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    To be clear, when I said I was thankful people didn't have guns I was actually referring to the criminals. That's why I don't live in fear, despite living in the "dangerous" area of the city.

    I live in the East End of London and walk past groups of sketchy youths trying to be threatening all the time. If they were ever to attempt mugging me (it's never happened, I'm a big guy) the worst that could happen is I might get punched. They're probably not going to point a gun in my face and I'm pretty happy about that.

    Similarly, when these gangs pass each other or confront each other in my area of town it usually ends up with them shouting "Brrap" a lot instead of actually shooting each other. It's unlikely I'll get caught in any cross-fire and I'm pretty happy about that too.

    Whether law-abiding citizens owning guns is a good idea is debatable. You've picked your side, I've picked mine. That's cool with me.

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