The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

It’s no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Senior Member RebelDogg's Avatar
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    Trouble with leg day...

    It seems like every leg day is getting more and more difficult for me. My upper body seems to be coming along pretty well. I see a big difference from when I first started lifting a couple of months ago. I feel different, I look different. But my legs are my big problem.

    I get DOMS from leg day that kill me for several days after. Upper body DOMS are barely noticeable. The only spot that I get it kinda bad are my triceps, but it's not unbearable. My quads and glutes, however, have me walking like an old man. Sitting on the toilet is a precarious endeavor...

    I feel like I get way too worn out way too quick, given the light weights I'm using. What I want to know is what is the most effective change for me? Should I do even less weight? Less reps and add sets? Should I just rest longer between sets? How much does bodyweight, in your experience, effect squats? I'm pretty heavy (263lbs/119kg).

    I'm aiming for fat loss, but am hoping to build a fair amount of muscle as I go. I'm not really concerned as much with muscular legs as upper body, but I do want strong legs. Also, I figure building the glutes and quads will be good for fat loss, since they are large muscles. Should I maybe focus on lower weight and higher reps, since I'm not likely to try to bulk muscle in my legs? Or should I treat it as I will my upper body?

    Anyway, here are some excerpts from my journal of my past few workouts, most recent first. As you can see, I've pussed out a few times. The past two leg days have been on Thursdays, which is a work day. Unfortunately, it was a heavy work day both times and I was tired before I ever started. I moved legs to Thursdays because of the DOMS. Give me the weekend to suffer through the worst of it rather than at work. Also, will make cardio days easier.

    TODAY:
    Front Squats (Triceps Bar) 66# 15x1, 116# 10x1, 136# 8x1, 146# 3x1, 136# 4x1, 116# 7x1 *Only enough rest to add/remove plates
    Romanian Dead Lift 150# 15x1, 250# 5x3
    Dead Lift 300# 3x1
    Sumo Squat (Barbell) 250# 3x1 *Uncomfortable. BB between legs. Felt something in abdomen. Not gonna work...
    Sumo Squats (Triceps Bar) 166# 10x1, 15x2 *Bar between legs, grabbed long sides. Not gonna work... go back to DBs...

    LAST WEEK:
    Front Squats: 66# 25x1, 116# 10x2, 146# 6x1, 116# 10x1
    Step Ups: 130# 5x1, 110# 5x1, 80# 8x2 (per leg)
    Romanian Dead Lift: 250# 6x2, 220# 6x3
    Dead Lift 290# 3x1, 2x1

    WEEK BEFORE:
    Tricep Bar Front Squats: 121# 10x2, 136# 6x1, 5x1
    Sumo Squats 150# DB: 12x2, 10x2
    Dead Lift 300# 6x1, 280# 2x1 *WTF happened here tonight?
    Step Ups 80# 10x1 (per leg)

    WEEK BEFORE:
    Dead Lift: 320# FAIL, 310# 3x, 290# 3x
    Dead Lift Calf Raises: 300# 12x1, 10x1, 280# 10x1
    Dumbell Sumo Squats: 150# 10x3
    17" Step Ups w/DB's: 100# 10x1
    Tri Bar Front Squats: 116# 8x3

    WEEK BEFORE THAT:
    Front Squats 120# 8x3, 100# 10x3 (wrists hurt like hell)
    Sumo Squats 105# 20x1, 125# 15x3
    Dead Lift 290# 7x3
    Calf Raises 290# 10x1 (left hand crapped out on me, tweaked back)
    Step Ups 80# (on knee high table) 12x1 (between my back and left hand I said screw it after I did both legs)

    FIRST WEEK IN JOURNAL:
    Front Squats w/triceps bar 106# 10x3
    DB Sumo Squats 80# 20x3
    BB Front Squats 50# 20x1 (no break from Sumo)
    Rack Pull (from bench, no rack) 200# 6x2
    Rack Pull (from bench, no rack) 200# 10x2
    Step ups (table a little under knee height) 80# (40x2 DB) 20x3
    Deadlift 200# 8x3
    Calf Raises 200# 15x4
    Last edited by RebelDogg; 07-15-2010 at 07:39 PM.

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  3. #2
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Training legs, especially squats and deadlifts, is HARD. Why do you think everybody wants to skip it?
    My advice is to stay with it and reap the rewards of strength and power.
    And for goodness sakes, pick a style and stick with it.
    Last edited by Off Road; 07-15-2010 at 07:46 PM.
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  4. #3
    Iplan Iplan's Avatar
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    Dog:

    I feel your pain. Lower body stuff can be so discouraging, and there's no way around the pain.

    That said it looks like you're doing a lot of stuff on leg day. Having Dead lifts and Squats on the same day would make me want to quit.

    Why not try to move Dead Lifts to another day?

    Here's what I do (Not asking anyone to critique my routine, just showing how I split the big 3 into 3 different days):

    Workout A: Chest, Biceps, Shoulders, Abs
    Rest Day
    Workout B: Dead Lift, Lat Rows, Triceps, Traps
    Rest Day
    Workout C: Squats, Forward Lunges, Reverse Lunges, Calves
    Rest Day

    I'm no trainer, but I think getting Squats and Dead Lifts on a different day would certainly help w/ the DOMs.

    I'm also in agreement with Off Road: swapping out the exercises every week is going to make progress hard to measure, and progress is what keeps everyone motivated.
    Last edited by Iplan; 07-15-2010 at 07:59 PM.
    Does this pose make my camera look big?

    "We're not as good as we want to be, we're not as good as we should be, but thank God we're not as bad as we used to be..."

  5. #4
    Senior Member RebelDogg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
    Training legs, especially squats and deadlifts, is HARD. Why do you think everybody wants to skip it?
    My advice is to stay with it and reap the rewards of strength and power.
    And for goodness sakes, pick a style and stick with it.
    I hear ya. I just wasn't sure if lowering the weights or changing the way I do something might make me more effective. I don't ever plan on quitting. I'm not sure what you mean by "pick a style." I'll admit, I try different things. I haven't been doing this long and want to see what works for me. Also, I'm limited by what equipment I have. I don't have a gym membership... Or do you mean I should be doing the same exercises the same way every week?

    Quote Originally Posted by Iplan View Post
    Dog:

    I feel your pain. Lower body stuff can be so discouraging, and there's no way around the pain.

    That said it looks like you're doing a lot of stuff on leg day. Having Dead lifts and Squats on the same day would make me want to quit.

    Why not try to move Dead Lifts to another day?

    Here's what I do (Not asking anyone to critique my routine, just showing how I split the big 3 into 3 different days):

    Workout A: Chest, Biceps, Shoulders
    Rest Day
    Workout B: Dead Lift, Lat Rows, Triceps
    Rest Day
    Workout C: Squats, Forward Lunges, Reverse Lunges, Calves
    Rest Day

    I'm no trainer, but I think getting Squats and Dead Lifts on a different day would certainly help w/ the DOMs....
    Good advice. I've been thinking of rethinking my split. Just need to figure out how I want to do it. Might sit down this weekend and figure out how I might change up for next week. I just figured deadlifts kinda went with lower body... but I see what you're doing, splitting things apart.

  6. #5
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    There is no reason to write your own routine. There are pleanty of routines to pick from here on WBB. Leave the routine designing to those with a lot more experience.

    When I say to pick something and stick to it, I mean pick one style of squat and do that every session. Switching around between back squats, front squats, goblet squats, or whatever will just leave you spinning your wheels and not progressing as fast as possible. Leave the style switching to the more advanced lifters. Besides, if you are giving your lower body a different workout every time, that will just add to the DOMS because your body won't ever get used to it.

    Lastly, as long as your form is good and you are not injuring yourself, I wouldn't recomend doing lighter weights. In fact I would recomend that you add weight every chance you get. That's how progression is made and muscle is built.
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  7. #6
    Iplan Iplan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RebelDogg View Post
    Or do you mean I should be doing the same exercises the same way every week?
    Yes... exact same exercises every week, (same sets and reps too). I know a lot of the veterans can't get by w/ this, but when you're just getting into the groove all you want to have to worry about is putting a few more pounds of plates on the bar each week.


    [/QUOTE] Good advice. I've been thinking of rethinking my split. Just need to figure out how I want to do it. Might sit down this weekend and figure out how I might change up for next week. I just figured deadlifts kinda went with lower body... but I see what you're doing, splitting things apart.[/QUOTE]

    I was using an A/B routine last fall that I'd made up myself, and it was killing me, because I was spending 90 minutes plus in the gym, and wasn't gaining all that much strength. I put up a few posts on the forum, and decided to simplify things (changed to the workout I listed up there) based on feedback I'd received, and my numbers just started jumping up tremendously. DOMs were still there, but the strength was really jumping up. It's a fair trade when you're seeing progress.
    Last edited by Iplan; 07-15-2010 at 08:20 PM.
    Does this pose make my camera look big?

    "We're not as good as we want to be, we're not as good as we should be, but thank God we're not as bad as we used to be..."

  8. #7
    Senior Member RebelDogg's Avatar
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    I hear ya. I need to look into some of those routines. I've looked at stuff before, but it always requires equipment I don't have. I just need to look around some more for something. I can't do back squats because I don't have a rack (yet), so I just do the front squats. But the BB kills my wrists, so I do it with a triceps bar, which is much more comfortable. But I have a tough time getting it up to my chest with more than about 146 pounds on it. I wasn't sure if I should do sumo squats and front squats together. I guess I'll have to pick one. I'm gonna look for a routine this weekend on the site. Thanks.

  9. #8
    Iplan Iplan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RebelDogg View Post
    I've looked at stuff before, but it always requires equipment I don't have. I just need to look around some more for something. I can't do back squats because I don't have a rack (yet), so I just do the front squats.
    lol... Dude you're reading my mail. That was my problem too ~ no rack. Another problem I had was many of the exercises they recommended in a particular workout I couldn't do because of an injury or something (especially stuff with the shoulders ~ I don't feel comfortable with any kind of shoulder press.... So I was always modifying out of necessity.....)

    One other point: Not sure of your budget, but I did recently pick up a squat rack from NY Barbell of Elmira (delivered for $350 ish)... it's a Sumo Rack.... so it's open on the top, and wider inside. I like it.
    http://www.newyorkbarbells.com/92565.html
    Last edited by Iplan; 07-15-2010 at 08:31 PM.
    Does this pose make my camera look big?

    "We're not as good as we want to be, we're not as good as we should be, but thank God we're not as bad as we used to be..."

  10. #9
    Senior Member RebelDogg's Avatar
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    Hmmm... 487 delivered. I kinda like that design, though. I was thinking more about this one:

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...pf_rd_i=507846

    Recent troubles, though, have messed up my money situation this month. Hoping to get it either next month or if not, then the following. It's the cheapest I've found and I've read good reviews. Kinda want to save up for the NYBB one, either that one or another I saw on their site. But Amazon has free shipping, which saves me like $160

    I'll have one soon. I'm trying like hell not to have to join a gym.

    Holy crap... 10:12 and I gotta be awake by 3:30... this is why I don't get enough sleep... this and Bejeweled Blitz on Facebook... damn you time wasting games...

  11. #10
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    If you can't squat decently, then focus on the dead-lift until you get a rack or cage. Here's a routine you can do until then, only because I feel "chatty" tonight

    Rotate these two workouts three days a week...

    Workout A:
    Deadlift - 2x8
    Split Squat - 2x12
    Heelraise - 2x12
    Sit-ups - 2x12

    Workout B:
    Bench - 2x8
    Rows - 2x8
    Press - 2x8
    Chins - 2xFailure
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  12. #11
    Senior Member RebelDogg's Avatar
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    Thanks, Off Road. I'm going to give that a try as best I can. Unfortunately I don't own a decent bench either... gonna get one when I get the cage so I can start doing the bench press. But I have one of those seated presses on my Weider machine. Working on chins now... getting better. Right now failure is 1/2 a chin up... But I'll get it. I just do negs to failure for now.

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