The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

It’s no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #26
    TJW Keith's Avatar
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    Jay, awesome to hear this, bro! I'll be following along for sure. I don't have anything to add other than what others have already told you. Your legs are obviously a strong point and very lean already so I don't doubt you'll be shredded by the time you step on stage. I wish you the best of luck.
    Age: 24 Height: 5'9" Weight: 185

    Gym PRs: 365/240/440=1045

    People need to quit ****ing asking what they need to do, exercise wise, until they reinforce their technique - Dave Tate

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  2. #27
    Super Moderator RBB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith View Post
    This is the only poor advice I've ever seen you give on here, LOL.

    I went through Phil and it was honestly the biggest mistake I've made with money and to this day, I get angry when I think about it. He was a complete jackass, had the writing of a 10 year old and like you said, pushed his LBAs on you and told you to only eat when hungry... which was ******ed and wouldn't work for many people. When I asked ANY questions, he'd become very angry and never answer any of them.
    Keith, was he just doing your diet? Or was it both diet and training?


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  3. #28
    TJW Keith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RBB View Post
    Keith, was he just doing your diet? Or was it both diet and training?
    Just diet.

    In case you're interested, this is copied and pasted from Phil:

    I want you to eat ONLY when hungry. Eat these nutrient grams, ok? 50 grams of carbs, 38 grams of protein, 17 grams of fat at EACH MEAL. After ten days, tell me how many meals on average you have eaten, ok? This way we can see what calorie number we have to be to keep your bodyweight the same/lose/gain. Please weigh yourself every day at the same time.Olive/coconut/walnut oil for fats, fruits/juices and green vegetables ONLY for carbs, liquid aminos and eggs, chicken, milk, soy or fish for protein.No powders for now........use my last name ( HERNON) at trueprotein.com, in the discount box, to get the Lean Beef Aminos.

    1. Lean Beef Aminos
    2. Kre Alkalyn-( better than monohydrate)
    3. 1 Aspirin per day
    4. Vitamin/mineral
    5. Fish Oils
    6. COQ10
    7. If on AAS, DHEA...25mg morning/25mg nightly
    Age: 24 Height: 5'9" Weight: 185

    Gym PRs: 365/240/440=1045

    People need to quit ****ing asking what they need to do, exercise wise, until they reinforce their technique - Dave Tate

    The never-ending pursuit of becoming Strong(er) - My Westside journal

  4. #29
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    That's actually a really interesting way to find maintenance, as it is so closely tied to hunger and satiety when eating quality foods.
    accuflex - LOLZZZZ!!!11one1!! SOEM PPL WORK THRE ARMZ!!!!11!! LETS KILL THEM111

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  5. #30
    TJW Keith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Behemoth View Post
    That's actually a really interesting way to find maintenance, as it is so closely tied to hunger and satiety when eating quality foods.
    It is, but it is impossible to follow for 90%+ of people.

    The vast majority of people can only eat on their breaks during their daily job. If I ate those macros for every meal, I'd be starving once I reach my breaks.
    Age: 24 Height: 5'9" Weight: 185

    Gym PRs: 365/240/440=1045

    People need to quit ****ing asking what they need to do, exercise wise, until they reinforce their technique - Dave Tate

    The never-ending pursuit of becoming Strong(er) - My Westside journal

  6. #31
    Super Moderator RBB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith View Post
    Just diet.

    In case you're interested, this is copied and pasted from Phil:

    I want you to eat ONLY when hungry. Eat these nutrient grams, ok? 50 grams of carbs, 38 grams of protein, 17 grams of fat at EACH MEAL. After ten days, tell me how many meals on average you have eaten, ok? This way we can see what calorie number we have to be to keep your bodyweight the same/lose/gain. Please weigh yourself every day at the same time.Olive/coconut/walnut oil for fats, fruits/juices and green vegetables ONLY for carbs, liquid aminos and eggs, chicken, milk, soy or fish for protein.No powders for now........use my last name ( HERNON) at trueprotein.com, in the discount box, to get the Lean Beef Aminos.

    1. Lean Beef Aminos
    2. Kre Alkalyn-( better than monohydrate)
    3. 1 Aspirin per day
    4. Vitamin/mineral
    5. Fish Oils
    6. COQ10
    7. If on AAS, DHEA...25mg morning/25mg nightly
    I agree, Keith. Not very practical for most people. I suppose if you had nothing to do all day but eat and train then this approach would be more effective. I have my own (unfavorable) opinions about Phil....he comes across as kind of dick and doesn't seem to know how to handle any sort of debate or questions about his methods. He immediately resorts to insults, which is very unprofessional to say the least. I guess he is either a love him or hate him type of guy. I spoke to BCC a few years ago when he was using Phil's program and he had only good things to say about the guy, so who knows?

    Jay, sorry if I derailed your thread here, bro. You are looking good, man. Keep the updates coming as the contest gets closer. I look forward to following your progress.


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  7. #32
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Heres a quick update.

    Taking this nice and slow, I'm like 13 weeks out at this point. Still got plenty of time

    Hopefully some big changes to come in the next couple of weeks...





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  8. #33
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Oh yeah, and RBB, you said you were interested in Phil's frequent training split. Well I actually started that up a couple weeks ago because I felt so burnout from the routine Alex gave me. Before I was doing a Mon-Fri split with chest/hams, tris/bis, legs, shoulders, and then back each getting their own day. Each bodypart would get 3-4 exercises with 2 sets to failure for each exercise.

    It was waaayyy too much for me, I felt like **** all the time, didnt want to workout, tired and worn down, moody to everyone around me, so I decided to switch things up. Now I gotta admit I feel great since switching to Phils style of training.

    His routine now is a 3 day on, 1 day off (originally it was 2 on, 1 off). Chest/back, squats/hams, and then bis/tris/shoulders.

    Its simple, you pick one exercise for each muscle and warmup with 2 sets, then for working sets you do 8-12 reps to failure, decrease 10%, go to failure, and then decrease another 10% til failure. Thats it. Then you move on to the next muscle. The only muscle group that gets more than 1 exercise is back which gets 2.

    Very simple, and it seems to be working very affectively. I wasn't going up on any lifts with Alex's routine and now I'm increasing weight all the time even while cutting with Phil's style.


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  9. #34
    Senior Member Allen Cress's Avatar
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    You are very lean for 13 weeks out so be very careful at this point. Being soo lean your body will start slowing things down to survive so to speak and you can lose muscle if you overdiet. With 13 weeks left and being so lean you should definitely have some re-feed days thrown in at some point depending on bio-feedback.

    Just be cautious as I've seen many competitors get soo caught up in being extremely conditioned they lose muscle but don'r see it til its too late.

    Looking great, keep up good work!

  10. #35
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    What are the macros working out to at this point? Any carb rotating? Refeeds? Cheat meals?

    You definitely look increasingly lean. It might just be the picture but you look pretty flat. You don't appear as hard in the quads as you did a month ago and seems less vascularity all over. Maybe you could benefit from a couple higher carb days rotated in? Maybe it's just the pictures. I'm sure you have a very keen eye as to what's going on with you.

    I don't remember, have you competed before or are you a veteran? You're gonna do great man.
    accuflex - LOLZZZZ!!!11one1!! SOEM PPL WORK THRE ARMZ!!!!11!! LETS KILL THEM111

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  11. #36
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice guys.

    I've been cheating about once a week, and when I do I feel guilty as ****!

    What would you guys recommend as far as a carb up day goes?

    Here is my current diet

    Meal 1- 1 cup oats, 3 scoops pro
    Meal 2- 10 oz chicken, 4 oz rice, veggies
    Meal 3- 10 oz steak, 4 oz rice, veggies
    Meal 4- 10 oz chicken, 4 oz rice
    Meal 5- Same as 4 OR 2.5 scoops pro with some oats and banana (post workout)
    Meal 6- typically 1 whole egg and 11 whites with a salad

    So I'm getting moderate carbs here, basically zero fats... Literally probably under 20 grams of fat from food. I take 6 grams of fish oil daily, though.

    Alex cut out all the fats about a month ago. My cardio is up to 45 minutes 5x per week.

    So after reading this over, do you guys think I should add in a higher carb day maybe? I mean I'm sticking to my trainers advice here but I would enjoy a day I can load up on food since I'm pretty far ahead of schedule... I trust my trainer 100% and he recommends no cheating if possible but one day a week isn't going to kill me at this point, atleast up until the 8 week out mark or so.

    Thanks for the input so far Allen and Behemoth. Oh and Behemoth, I'm no vet, this is my first time prepping for a show. I'll be honest, I'm nervous as **** right now on how this is going to turn out... I feel small as hell
    Last edited by jAy_Dub; 01-21-2011 at 12:12 PM.


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  12. #37
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Oh and one other thing, i agree with the flat comment. I'm very very flat compared to the first set of pics. Vascularity doesn't show itself nearly as much as it used to since I've cut down on carbs.


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  13. #38
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    Well your trainer knows WAY better than me without question. And really you should follow whatever he says. Having said that...

    My calculations came up that you're eating about 165g carbs per day from rice and oats. Probably another 20 or so from the salad and protein powder?
    With 6 days of training and 3.75 hours of cardio per week consuming less than 1200g of carbs weekly I'm not suprised you're flattening out.

    I may be wrong but I want to say fully depleted it takes around 6-7g of carbs per pound of LBM to fill out (plus a hundred or two in the liver). So if you're around 200lbs of LBM and pretty depleted you could probably safely get away with eating a quite ridiculous number in your current state that will only go to liver and muscle.

    How often does Alex get update pics from you and is he concerned if about you becoming very depleted with still 13 weeks to go? To be honest if I were in your shoes I'd probably put away a 500-1000g refeed and assess how you look and how the next week progresses off of it. With 13 weeks you have certainly have room to see if this slows you, speeds you up, or keeps you leaning out the same.

    But again, your coach probably knows much better than me.
    accuflex - LOLZZZZ!!!11one1!! SOEM PPL WORK THRE ARMZ!!!!11!! LETS KILL THEM111

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  14. #39
    Super Moderator RBB's Avatar
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    Jay, you're looking very good and way ahead of schedule. Back shot looks great. If I were you I would have a high carb day once a week right now. However, Alex definitely knows what he's doing....tough call. One thing I have noticed about his guys, though....they come in extremely shredded but sometimes a little flat. He definitely stresses conditioning over size. I guess it all depends on what you're going for. I don't see how one high carb day a week could do anything but help you at this point, though. You're ahead of schedule already with plenty of time to go.
    Last edited by RBB; 01-21-2011 at 12:41 PM.


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  15. #40
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice guys.

    Alex actually told me "flat is good right now" a week or so ago. And I trust him on that. But seeing as I've been dieting going on 10 weeks already, a carb up day sounds great. It may be exactly what I need...

    For now, I think I'll give it a try. Fridays are my day off so I'll start it up today. Lots of pretzels, clean cereals, etc on the way

    Any good ideas on some half way healthy carb up foods??

    RBB, youre right bro, one thing I have noticed with Alex himself is that he comes in to shows flat and doesnt add much size each year (like we've talked about before). CRAZY conditioning though. I hate to say anything negative about him though, hes cool as hell, responds to me withing MINUTES, answers all my questions with long explanations, and is just a overall cool ass guy. I'd recommend him to anyone. He puts his heart into each client.


    Behemoth, are you going to school for nutrition? I like your calculated approach. Honestly I havent even looked into exact numbers, I just do what I'm told.


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  16. #41
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jAy_Dub View Post
    Thanks for the advice guys.

    Alex actually told me "flat is good right now" a week or so ago. And I trust him on that. But seeing as I've been dieting going on 10 weeks already, a carb up day sounds great. It may be exactly what I need...

    For now, I think I'll give it a try. Fridays are my day off so I'll start it up today. Lots of pretzels, clean cereals, etc on the way

    Any good ideas on some half way healthy carb up foods??

    RBB, youre right bro, one thing I have noticed with Alex himself is that he comes in to shows flat and doesnt add much size each year (like we've talked about before). CRAZY conditioning though. I hate to say anything negative about him though, hes cool as hell, responds to me withing MINUTES, answers all my questions with long explanations, and is just a overall cool ass guy. I'd recommend him to anyone. He puts his heart into each client.


    Behemoth, are you going to school for nutrition? I like your calculated approach. Honestly I havent even looked into exact numbers, I just do what I'm told.

    Lol, no not at all. Just dieted a time or two.

    For refeed foods there are some great threads on that over on lyle mcdonalds board. Soft pretzels and cereals are definetly favorites of mine though.
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  17. #42
    Senior Member Allen Cress's Avatar
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    One thing you should do is always listen and do everything your coach says regardless if we agree with him or not. If you still want to make changes then there is a trust issue. With that being said things you should or shouldn't do would b based on your energy levels, concentration levels, hunger , appetite , sleeping patterns, weight loss, among other factors. As lean as you are at this point and with 3 months to go I would definitely be making some tweaks to the diet and cardio to make sure to preserve muscle. Your training program is also important.

    But since you hired a coach you should listen and do everything he says or go somewhere else for a coach. Trust is important in a coaching relationship. I've been doing this for over a decade now and anytime I have a client and they start doing other things than what is prescribed it can and usually does mess up the prep.

  18. #43
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Allen Cress View Post
    One thing you should do is always listen and do everything your coach says regardless if we agree with him or not. If you still want to make changes then there is a trust issue. With that being said things you should or shouldn't do would b based on your energy levels, concentration levels, hunger , appetite , sleeping patterns, weight loss, among other factors. As lean as you are at this point and with 3 months to go I would definitely be making some tweaks to the diet and cardio to make sure to preserve muscle. Your training program is also important.

    But since you hired a coach you should listen and do everything he says or go somewhere else for a coach. Trust is important in a coaching relationship. I've been doing this for over a decade now and anytime I have a client and they start doing other things than what is prescribed it can and usually does mess up the prep.
    You're right man. And I made sure to tell him about it. I'm not going to be doing things secretly behind his back or anything.. I still have 12 weeks, so one high carb day isnt going to kill me at this point, thats for sure.

    I paid a lot of money for this guy, so I'm definitely not going to mess this up...


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  19. #44
    Senior Member cphafner's Avatar
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    about time you posted pics over here and not on that other site! haha. Looking great man.
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  20. #45
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cphafner View Post
    about time you posted pics over here and not on that other site! haha. Looking great man.
    Thanks Conor, I had to come back to my roots, this is where at the madness began

    More pics to come this Sunday. Cardio is up to 50 minutes now and Alex wants updates by the end of the week. I'm thinkin this week is going to show some significant changes

    We'll see. I'll take shots of all the mandatory poses. I have to start working on those hard from here on out. Overall I'm clueless when it comes to posing...


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  21. #46
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Heres a few I just sent in to my trainer by his request but tomorrow when I have more time I'll be taking lots of all of the mandatory poses and stuff so I'll pose them up when I do. For now, nothing special but leaning up pretty nicely.
    Attached Images Attached Images


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  22. #47
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Just for ****s and giggles here is what I looked like when I first started dieting hard.





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  23. #48
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    Big noticeable improvements from you last set. Quads look grainier and overall you look leaner and harder. Looks like your lower back is being the most stubborn area and will be the very last to go.

    Good stuff. What do you weigh now? Is the diet still as it has been or has alex mixed in any tweaks or changes? You are doing very well under him no doubt.
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  24. #49
    A gallon a day, everyday! ThomasG's Avatar
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    Definitely lookin leaner and harder.
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  25. #50
    Determined jAy_Dub's Avatar
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    Diet hasn't changed too much really. I told him I was having fat free cheese on my egg whites and some salads and he put an end to it lol. Same with some very low cal salad dressing.. The basard is taking the only enjoyment I had left! haha

    Here are the pics I took today. Still working on that damn side chest shot and tri is horrible as well. Posing is a bitch for me. I'm going to have to create the illusion I'm not so damn tall. I'll get a side chest shot up later when I'm satisfied with my posing.
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