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Thread: Tired of being skinny?

  1. #76
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Waiting for the scale to move just a couple of pounds a month is not an accurate method to track gains. I can go up or down a couple of pounds in just a couple of days. It would take several months of this micro-managing to see a pattern, and by that time you may have wasted a couple of months of potential progress. Might work okay for the advanced guys that have everything dialed in and are looking to add those last few percent, but I wouldn't recommend it for beginners or intermediates.
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  2. #77
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
    Waiting for the scale to move just a couple of pounds a month is not an accurate method to track gains. I can go up or down a couple of pounds in just a couple of days. It would take several months of this micro-managing to see a pattern, and by that time you may have wasted a couple of months of potential progress. Might work okay for the advanced guys that have everything dialed in and are looking to add those last few percent, but I wouldn't recommend it for beginners or intermediates.
    Despite our difference in this thread, this is an excellent point offroad.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

    Progress pics of a cut using bodyweight only movements http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/sho...45#post2405745

    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMcGuire View Post
    Despite our difference in this thread, this is an excellent point offroad.
    Agree 1,000,000%

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris mason View Post
    The body wants to stay in homeostasis that includes maintaining a certain body weight. For younger men who have trouble gaining weight adding just a few hundred calories usually won't do it as the body will adjust to account for the extra caloric intake.
    This is exactly what I learned the hard way.

    Also exacly why I think the concept of a "lean bulk" doesn't work so well for everybody. Like I mentioned my body seems to have about a 1000 calorie "window" where nothing happens at all. No loss or gains in either weight or strength. I wasted a lot of time trying that, the 300-500 calorie surpluses didn't do anything. 1000+ surpluses, that is 1000+ calories over what my bodybug says is what I had to do to make any real gains, and even that was only 1 lb per week.

    My point is mathmateiclty 1000 calorie surpluses should equat to 2 lbs per week, AND according to those who fear fat gains(which I was) at least 75% of that "should" be fat (because one can only gain .5 lbs of muscle per week or whatever). So it was that way of thinking that kept me skinny for years. With that said, this is why I agree with the original post. Newbie skinny guys, afriad of fat gains seriously just need to EAT and quit worrying about girly sh&t. What I learned my counting calories trying to gain weight is you don't even need to count at all. If you work hard enough in the gym and listen to your bodies needs(I mean really obey what it tells you), you should be eating enough to want to recover and you'll make gains.

    The funny part is I feared fat gain but even with a 24 lb gain I still have the same visual abs. My bodyfat percentage didn't move much at all.
    Last edited by Yamar; 01-23-2011 at 02:48 PM.

  5. #80
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Good points Yamar, but I still feel some people, myself included, do need to count Calories sometimes. I didn't gain any weight until I purposely tracked all my Calories and made sure I hit that amount day in and day out. Eating to comfort or just how you "feel" keeps a lot of people from making gains. Most of the time, I was miserable and had to fight puking after each meal, lol.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

    Progress pics of a cut using bodyweight only movements http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/sho...45#post2405745

    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  6. #81
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    Speaking for myself, once I stopped trying to bottom out my weight and fat as much as I could and started eating, I began having a lot more fun. More strength, more scale movement, more energy, MORE FOOD (God I love stuffing my face once in a while). I can see minor increases in my physical appearance, fat wise, when I bulk up that don't really matter (even my abs are staying pretty constant during a bulk), and then I start to see more and more toned and growing muscles sticking out as I cut back down. Staying at my lowest weight and seeing it drop maybe .25lbs or .5lbs a day if that and being low on energy with minimal strength improvement wasn't getting me anywhere and was not fun at all...

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    Last edited by Codeguru; 01-23-2011 at 04:11 PM.

  7. #82
    Senior Member Meat_Head's Avatar
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    A couple thoughts: the biggest and strongest people in the world carry around a ton of extra body fat, therefore it is safe to assume a high calorie diet (i.e. way more than you "need") is essential for the greatest gains in hypertrophy and strength.

    That being said, everyone wants to be as strong as a superheavyweight powerlifter but not everyone wants to look like it. Dan made a great post about goals, and that's what this comes down to IMO, and I think that's what OffRoad was getting at (correct me if I'm wrong). There are too many skinny guys who claim that all they want to do is get bigger and put on some muscle weight. If that is your goal, you must FORGET about abs, being able to run 5 miles nonstop, etc etc, especially if you have a high metabolism. If that is your goal, MAKE it your goal and overeat overeat overeat while busting your ass in the gym and you will meet your goal.
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  8. #83
    Moderator Off Road's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meat_Head View Post
    That being said, everyone wants to be as strong as a superheavyweight powerlifter but not everyone wants to look like it. Dan made a great post about goals, and that's what this comes down to IMO, and I think that's what OffRoad was getting at (correct me if I'm wrong). There are too many skinny guys who claim that all they want to do is get bigger and put on some muscle weight. If that is your goal, you must FORGET about abs, being able to run 5 miles nonstop, etc etc, especially if you have a high metabolism. If that is your goal, MAKE it your goal and overeat overeat overeat while busting your ass in the gym and you will meet your goal.
    That is exactly what I was trying to say. Thanks for explaining it in a different way.
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  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meat_Head View Post
    A couple thoughts: the biggest and strongest people in the world carry around a ton of extra body fat, therefore it is safe to assume a high calorie diet (i.e. way more than you "need") is essential for the greatest gains in hypertrophy and strength.

    That being said, everyone wants to be as strong as a superheavyweight powerlifter but not everyone wants to look like it. Dan made a great post about goals, and that's what this comes down to IMO, and I think that's what OffRoad was getting at (correct me if I'm wrong). There are too many skinny guys who claim that all they want to do is get bigger and put on some muscle weight. If that is your goal, you must FORGET about abs, being able to run 5 miles nonstop, etc etc, especially if you have a high metabolism. If that is your goal, MAKE it your goal and overeat overeat overeat while busting your ass in the gym and you will meet your goal.
    Ya see I just don't understand why everyone must thing so one-sided. You can get strong and build muscle and still maintain good cardovascular fitness. I went from 130 lb marathon runner to 154 lb and I still maintain about 15 miles of runing per week. Also I gained a little fat but I can still see abs. I have no intentions of EVER being what anyone woud describe as fat or overweight yet I managed to accomplish a reasonable goal of a 24 lb gain in 20 weeks.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yamar View Post
    Ya see I just don't understand why everyone must thing so one-sided. You can get strong and build muscle and still maintain good cardovascular fitness. I went from 130 lb marathon runner to 154 lb and I still maintain about 15 miles of runing per week. Also I gained a little fat but I can still see abs. I have no intentions of EVER being what anyone woud describe as fat or overweight yet I managed to accomplish a reasonable goal of a 24 lb gain in 20 weeks.
    But you're still only 154 lbs. To get truly big and strong (220+ at a minimum) it will be tough to stay super-lean and still do a bunch of running and reach those goals. If your goal isn't to try and get that big, that's fine but you can't necessarily equate going from 130 to 154 to someone wanting to get to 220 or 250 or more. In order to get extreme results you have to take extreme measures (at least for the genetically average).

  11. #86
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Yea, but walking around at 250 or whatever is going to entail a lot of body fat.


    Then again, some people look better at 15% bf rather than say like 8%.

    I agree with Sean in that its going to depend a lot of what your goals are.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

    Progress pics of a cut using bodyweight only movements http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/sho...45#post2405745

    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean S View Post
    But you're still only 154 lbs. To get truly big and strong (220+ at a minimum) it will be tough to stay super-lean and still do a bunch of running and reach those goals. If your goal isn't to try and get that big, that's fine but you can't necessarily equate going from 130 to 154 to someone wanting to get to 220 or 250 or more. In order to get extreme results you have to take extreme measures (at least for the genetically average).
    Thats what I was thinking exactly, I just didn't know how to say it without being a jerk.

    I imagine if we did a poll of guys taht are over 200lbs, and "strong" (300/400/500) there would be a very small % of them that run more than 15 miles per week. If you did a survey with things like (less than 1 mile, 1-5 miles, 6-10, 10-15, and 15+, I can almost guarantee the "less than one" and "1-5 would be the most". In addition this would be even more evident if you looked at guys that were truly big (250+) and truly strong (500/700/800).

    The fact is, running would serve almost no purpose, and would end up being a waste of calories and dip into your recovery. There are other training methods that would accomplish the same things and more.

  13. #88
    Father of Three Bosch232's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Fanelli View Post

    The fact is, running would serve almost no purpose, and would end up being a waste of calories and dip into your recovery.

    To those of us unfortunate enough to genetically lean towards high blood pressure, the cardio serves a good purpose. But that's probably another discussion for another day.
    "A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." ~ C.S. Lewis

  14. #89
    Wannabebig New Member arche's Avatar
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    You have to do some efforts to gain the weight.
    join the jym for your exercise. make a healthy diet plan, and consult a
    personal trainer for the abs and strength.

  15. #90
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    Yeah I guess it depends on goals. I still don't think that keeping cardio in your routine can effect gains like you guys make it out to sound. AND cardiovascular exercise is good for overall health(not that I'm assuming this thread cares about that, Just making the point). A 200 lb guy will burn about 150 calories per mile. 150x 15 miles per week= 2250 calories burned weekly. That's an extra 320 calories per day which can be compenstated for with one trip to the vening machine. And don't give me that running is catobolic hogwash because it takes A LOT of running for it to dip into muscle tissue (like beyond 60 minutes per session).

  16. #91
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    I logged 1,000's of miles in my young and mid-twenties and still like to run. However, when I decided that I wanted to add some muscle on my body, I didn't run at the same time. For me it wasn't really a matter of the calories, it was the energy and recovery. I didn't have the energy to do both well.

    I'm back to logging ~15 miles / week now. I will probably build that up to ~30 miles / week. Feels good to get back to running.

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yamar View Post
    Yeah I guess it depends on goals. I still don't think that keeping cardio in your routine can effect gains like you guys make it out to sound. AND cardiovascular exercise is good for overall health(not that I'm assuming this thread cares about that, Just making the point). A 200 lb guy will burn about 150 calories per mile. 150x 15 miles per week= 2250 calories burned weekly. That's an extra 320 calories per day which can be compenstated for with one trip to the vening machine. And don't give me that running is catobolic hogwash because it takes A LOT of running for it to dip into muscle tissue (like beyond 60 minutes per session).
    Running for a 200+ lb. guy is different than for someone much smaller. It's not just a matter of the number of calories burned during the running itself. There is also the catabolism associated with the impact of running, which is exponentially higher for some 200+ lbs. It's also that you are sending your body "mixed" signals by doing strenuous cardio and hard strength training at the same time and thus end up with sub-optimal strength and size adaptations. I do agree that maintaining some sort of cardiovascular fitness while gaining is ideal. I just don't believe running is the best way to do that for those serious about size and strength. Doing some modest (~120 beat per minute), non-impact cardio for 30 minutes a few times a week can maintain some cardiovascular fitness while not impacting size and strength gains. Running would beat up the joints and soft tissues too much for a bigger guy to maximize size and strength potential. For me any distance running whatsoever absolutely kills my lower body strength and size.
    Again if you are simply wanting well-rounded fitness and health, combining running with weight training is fine. For those wanting to be really big and strong, they have to specialize to a significant degree while doing a minimum to maintain other aspects of fitness.

  18. #93
    Senior Member Meat_Head's Avatar
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    Great post Sean, hit it on the head
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