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Thread: Gaining and Losing Muscle

  1. #1
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Gaining and Losing Muscle

    Im stumped on something:

    In the past I had a trial and error run. (December 2011) I bulked to 235lb in hopes of new strength and size. I got both. I wanted to cut to about 220lb for college ball, especially since I was changing positions. I started cutting (March 2012) and in a heartbeat, I dropped to 205lb and lost muscle strength, and minimal bodyfat. It was a nightmare.

    Fast forward:

    I have since learned a lot, now staying at 215-220lb and getting stronger, faster and conditioned with football training at my new college. (Transferred this past january from a D-1 school.)

    I want to learn more about the cutting topic for my general interest, however.

    When someone cuts, do they lose muscle from the calorie deficit or lack of protein intake? If a person at 235lb, shooting for 220lb with minimal/all fat loss for those 15lb in mind, can they keep their protein intake at 220 grams a day and not worry to much with calorie counting (within reason), so long as they know they are getting that protein?
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  2. #2
    Moderator joey54's Avatar
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    You lose muscle by losing weight too fast usually. Also people often think they have more muscle than they usually do, not saying this applies in your case.


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  3. #3
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    The bigger the deficit the more important the protein becomes.

    And x2 to what Joey said, most people overestimate their muscle mass when chubby. Additionally they freak out when they get depleted because glycogen loss can seem like a rapid muscle loss if you don't recognize it for what it is.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Makes sense. Thanks for the input guys !
    (Raw)
    Bench: 350
    Squat: 475
    Dead: 500

    "All people dream but not equally. Those who dream by night in the recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous ones, for they may act their dream with open eyes to make it possible."

  5. #5
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    As an athlete, I'd stop wasting your time with this. Once you're done, have at it. It will bring you great dissappointment, though. There are several reasons why losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time are possible. DRUGS! It can be done without, but it's not likely. Unless you take 6 months to drop 10-15lbs.

    The point is, stop worrying about being ripped as a football player. Be physically able to play your position. Anyone who has a clue knows that you should carry a little more bodyfat, especially as a strength athlete (football - the real strength sport). Eat big, sleep well, follow your S&C program to the letter and let your body do what it does.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RhodeHouse View Post
    As an athlete, I'd stop wasting your time with this. Once you're done, have at it. It will bring you great dissappointment, though. There are several reasons why losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time are possible. DRUGS! It can be done without, but it's not likely. Unless you take 6 months to drop 10-15lbs.

    The point is, stop worrying about being ripped as a football player. Be physically able to play your position. Anyone who has a clue knows that you should carry a little more bodyfat, especially as a strength athlete (football - the real strength sport). Eat big, sleep well, follow your S&C program to the letter and let your body do what it does.
    Matt, I completely agree.

    As I said, this was more or less for my general interest in the topic, not so I can attempt to cut and be 'ripped.'
    And I wasn't really asking if gaining muscle while losing fat is possible, (I understand the fallacies behind that) I was more leaning towards 'why' someone loses muscle during a cut. Again, for my general knowledge.

    But as stated, I agree with you. Thanks. Looking forward to see how I turn out for next season.
    (Raw)
    Bench: 350
    Squat: 475
    Dead: 500

    "All people dream but not equally. Those who dream by night in the recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous ones, for they may act their dream with open eyes to make it possible."

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whoopipally View Post
    Matt, I completely agree.

    As I said, this was more or less for my general interest in the topic, not so I can attempt to cut and be 'ripped.'
    And I wasn't really asking if gaining muscle while losing fat is possible, (I understand the fallacies behind that) I was more leaning towards 'why' someone loses muscle during a cut. Again, for my general knowledge.

    But as stated, I agree with you. Thanks. Looking forward to see how I turn out for next season.
    I'm no nutrition expert, but I would guess the lack of calories will lead to some muscle loss. If the protein intake is high enough, I imagine the muscle loss won't be as much. I think it's the lack of calories is the main issue. A nutrition guy would betetr answer this.

  8. #8
    Moderator Matthew Bryduck's Avatar
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    I know Layne Norton does natural bodybuilding and brings himself and the other guys hes working with in SHREDDED! I would look him up and see if you can find a free protocol he might have out there.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Thanks Matt and Matthew !
    (Raw)
    Bench: 350
    Squat: 475
    Dead: 500

    "All people dream but not equally. Those who dream by night in the recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous ones, for they may act their dream with open eyes to make it possible."

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