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Thread: Frustrated after 2-3 years! Need help

  1. #1
    Wannabebig Member
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    Frustrated after 2-3 years! Need help

    Hey guys, its my first post here, but i have been training for 2-3years pretty solid. Pleas take the time to read this, it'll help me a ton. Stats:

    Age: 19
    Height: 6'1
    Weight: 170lbs

    Lifts *1RM: Beginning Now
    Deadlifts 95 335
    Squat 55 245
    Bench 45 185
    OHP 45 125

    My lifts have gone up well, my bodyweight has gone up from 140lbs to 170lbs, but i am still skinny fat! I hate it. i tried cutting for a bit this month at 2200 calories, carbs/prot at 200g, and fats between 70-90g. I wanted to cut a lot, but i realized I'm skinny fat STILL and now i wanna go back to gaining weight.

    I need help with a diet that i can gain healthy weight. I don't wanna gain a lot of fat and be a slob. I think one of my big problems in terms of gaining weights has been carbs, so i was gonna start eating 400-500g of carbs. Is that a bad idea?

    Also, my arms never Grow! My arms now are bout 12inches - 13inches flexed. It sucks and is depressing. Any help with gaining size?

    Last thing is, what routine would you suggest for gaining size? Ive been doing Layne Norton's PHAT for several months, the first 3 months i made great profess, but now i haven't made any and i know i need to switch it up.

    If you need pictures of body comparison and bodyfat i can do that tomorrow if youd like. It doesn't look like ive set foot in the gym, and its embarassing.

    Thanks for all the help!

  2. #2
    Rory Parker Behemoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ark94 View Post
    Hey guys, its my first post here, but i have been training for 2-3years pretty solid. Pleas take the time to read this, it'll help me a ton. Stats:

    Age: 19
    Height: 6'1
    Weight: 170lbs

    Lifts *1RM: Beginning Now
    Deadlifts 95 335
    Squat 55 245
    Bench 45 185
    OHP 45 125

    My lifts have gone up well, my bodyweight has gone up from 140lbs to 170lbs, but i am still skinny fat! I hate it. i tried cutting for a bit this month at 2200 calories, carbs/prot at 200g, and fats between 70-90g. I wanted to cut a lot, but i realized I'm skinny fat STILL and now i wanna go back to gaining weight.

    I need help with a diet that i can gain healthy weight. I don't wanna gain a lot of fat and be a slob. I think one of my big problems in terms of gaining weights has been carbs, so i was gonna start eating 400-500g of carbs. Is that a bad idea?

    Also, my arms never Grow! My arms now are bout 12inches - 13inches flexed. It sucks and is depressing. Any help with gaining size?

    Last thing is, what routine would you suggest for gaining size? Ive been doing Layne Norton's PHAT for several months, the first 3 months i made great profess, but now i haven't made any and i know i need to switch it up.

    If you need pictures of body comparison and bodyfat i can do that tomorrow if youd like. It doesn't look like ive set foot in the gym, and its embarassing.

    Thanks for all the help!
    If you're skinny fat don't be indecisive and wobble in opposite endeavors. You said you tried cutting for a month, but now you want to gain weight. A month is pretty brief unless there was little work to be done to begin with. If you're certain that gaining weight is now the appropriate course of action to get you closer to your goals and more comfortable in your own skin for the duration then stick to it until significant progress has been made and then reevaluate. Don't decide you're too sloppy a month into it and decide to go back to cutting for a while.

    I'll let someone else suggest specific routines. Whatever you choose make sure it's heavy and hard, and that you're always progressing in weight on the bar. Lots of big compound lifts and you're going to grow EVERYWHERE, arms included. If your arms actually lag behind the rest of your body then consider giving them their own arm day. But don't piss with 21 rep curls and tricep kickbacks. Do heavy exercises like close grip becnh, dips, and some variation of curl where you're regularly adding weight to the bar.

    400-500g of carbs sounds like it may be excessive, but it's impossible to actually determine without knowing how much of the other macronutrients you're eating AND how many calories you've previously used for both gaining and losing weight. If you elaborate on your diet more as far as calories and macros go (don't bother including what specific foods you ate however as it's not really necessary) we might be able to give you some more direction on sorting out a diet that has you gaining at an appropriate rate.
    Last edited by Behemoth; 02-24-2013 at 12:22 PM.
    accuflex - LOLZZZZ!!!11one1!! SOEM PPL WORK THRE ARMZ!!!!11!! LETS KILL THEM111

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  3. #3
    Senior Member GazzyG's Avatar
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    Gotta set your goals and stick to them.

    I'd love to have 10% bodyfat with ripped abs, but I also want to compete in a meet and run a half-marathon, so it's not going to happen until after I've accomplished them.

    I've been training the same length of time as you and I started older (25, now 28) and what I found worked was aiming for maximum strength rather than size. And EATING enough to fuel it.

    It worked. Went from ~150lbs to 203lbs (as of yesterday). Lifts up across the board.

    And I'm pretty confident that if I dropped a little weight over the next few weeks, I'd look pretty good thanks to all the heavy (for me) lifting that I'm doing.

    My advice? Follow Behemoth's advice and jump on a heavy lifting program, like 5/3/1 or Westside.
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  4. #4
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Post pics. I want to get an idea of what I think there is for potential.

    Have you checked out or HCT-12 program? It is free.

    As you have gained body weight have you also gained fat? In other words, are you much fatter at 170 lbs than 140 lbs?

    If you were 140 lbs at 6'1" you are definitely on the naturally think side. I'm curious, do you run etc.?


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  5. #5
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    I'm no expert but this just an idea.

    How about switching up to a powerlifting routine for a while and see if it helps. I couldn't put myself in your position as I've never used bodybuilding routines, but since I've started lifting about 10 1/2 months ago I've got alot heavier, way stronger and I can still see my abs. Most of that training was pure powerlifting with almost no assistance work.

    Just a thought.
    The only lift I'm proud of at this point is a close stance, ass to grass zercher squat of 170kg x2 at 85kg bw. If only they held zercher squat competitions...

  6. #6
    Moderator Matthew Bryduck's Avatar
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    ark94,

    Its looks to me like your lifts are have improved since you started, which is good. I also agree with Chris Mason and also suggest the HCT-12 program. For your goals of gaining muscle while loosing fat, I recommend carb backloading. I have the Ebook and if you interested in it, I can email it to you. My best suggest for you arms, is to have a day where you strictly train your arms. I personally do 3 tricep and 3 bicep exercises (4 sets each) with a tricep movement superset with a bicep movement. I have been doing this for the last month and I've probably added an inch to my arms.

    If you have anymore questions, don't be afraid to ask.

    Matt

  7. #7
    Wannabebig Member
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    Hey guys thanks, sorry for the late response!

    So let me hammer through these, first off my diet that I'm going for to gain weight its approx. 3400 calories, given my maintenance is 2500-2700. Except me metabolism is fairly fast, and gaining muscle is hard for me without fat.

    My macro breakdown is 400-500g carbs, 200-250g protein, 70-100g fat. But i think i can reduce the carbs by a lot, and increase my fat intake?

    In terms of pictures, here is where i am at:





    As you have gained body weight have you also gained fat? In other words, are you much fatter at 170 lbs than 140 lbs?

    If you were 140 lbs at 6'1" you are definitely on the naturally think side. I'm curious, do you run etc.?
    Compared to when i was 140lbs, which im trying to find pictures and give to you but ill have them up later, im more muscular and less fat, but it still sucks.

    I don't run now anymore cause i wanted to gain size! But i feel like cardio would help me in gaining weight, im not saying running cause i lose a lot of size fast doing that, but skipping and bodyweight exercises (plyometrics?).

    And to everyone else suggesting a heavy training program, I'll definitely attempt that! Reason i stayed away from it for about a year was because i hurt my back, but i learned how to rehabilitate it myself and ive healed it, except there may be times where i get the odd pains if i do certain exercises that stress it too much (ie. bent over rows). I can squat and deadlift so thats all good.

    I'm really going to check out this HCT-12 program! thanks for all the responses.

  8. #8
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    I read through both HCT and Wendler's 5/3/1 (heard about this before) and i like Wendlers program. I am going to go on that program and see how it treats me.
    Last edited by ark94; 02-25-2013 at 02:44 PM.

  9. #9
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Ok, see how it goes. Frankly, I think you need more of a bodybuilding program as you need hypertrophy... You have very little muscle mass. Wendler's program is for absolute strength, not really size.


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  10. #10
    Moderator Matthew Bryduck's Avatar
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    You say you've been training for about 2-3 years, but how hard have you actually trained and pushed yourself? I personally have worked with a guy that was 150lbs and I put him through 3 or 4 months of solid hypertrophy training with his diet to support the workouts, he gained a solid 10-15lbs (I'm sure some it was fat as well). When I walk in the gym, I prepare for war! I wage war on that muscle I am training and I do not let my muscle tell me when I had enough, I tell it when I'm done. This is how you must treat working out!!! You can't go to the gym, pussy foot around and talk to your "bro" for 10 mins in between sets. I'm gonna brutally honest, you physique doesn't tell me what I just explained to you. I'm going to piggy pack what Chris Mason said about the 5/3/1 program being for strength and not building pure mass.

    Here is what I want you to leave with what I said. Watch a couple videos of pro bodybuilders training and tell me if you train with that kind of intensity.. If you have anymore questions or concerns, this is the place to ask. I'm not trying to put you down in anyway, but training to make you ask yourself... Are you leaving it all in the gym?

    Matt

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Bryduck View Post
    Chris Mason said about the 5/3/1 program being for strength and not building pure mass.

    Here is what I want you to leave with what I said. Watch a couple videos of pro bodybuilders training and tell me if you train with that kind of intensity.. If you have anymore questions or concerns, this is the place to ask. I'm not trying to put you down in anyway, but training to make you ask yourself... Are you leaving it all in the gym?

    Matt
    This is the honest answer to that, in the beginning no i did not have intensity. Then i made friends with the Canadian powerlifting team, and they took me under there wing to teach me form, and help me gain my strength from doing the bar, to doing 2 plates. That was year 1, not much size gains but a lot of strength.

    Year 2 i got to train with a local bodybuilder. he showed me this whole new level of intensity when training, and would constantly make me do forced reps, drop sets, etc and thats when i gained a lot of size. But after that, in year 3 i ended up injuring my back, and the whole year has been dedicated to strengthening my posterior chain, and core to overcome the injury which i have done, so i couldn't train heavy until 5 months ago. But now, i go hard in the gym. I sweat buckets, and i drain every ounce of energy i have when working out cause i know i wont see any results if i half ass it.

    Now i want to gain size, only reason i started the 5/3/1 (which i did squat workout A yesterday) was because you guys recommended it. I have always only really trained strength, never hypertrophy except with that bodybuilder...

    What are some good bodybuilding programs? I'll look around and see if i can find anything.

  12. #12
    DeaTH BeFoRe WeaKNeSs sCaRz*Of*PaiN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Bryduck View Post
    You say you've been training for about 2-3 years, but how hard have you actually trained and pushed yourself? I personally have worked with a guy that was 150lbs and I put him through 3 or 4 months of solid hypertrophy training with his diet to support the workouts, he gained a solid 10-15lbs (I'm sure some it was fat as well). When I walk in the gym, I prepare for war! I wage war on that muscle I am training and I do not let my muscle tell me when I had enough, I tell it when I'm done. This is how you must treat working out!!! You can't go to the gym, pussy foot around and talk to your "bro" for 10 mins in between sets. I'm gonna brutally honest, you physique doesn't tell me what I just explained to you. I'm going to piggy pack what Chris Mason said about the 5/3/1 program being for strength and not building pure mass.

    Here is what I want you to leave with what I said. Watch a couple videos of pro bodybuilders training and tell me if you train with that kind of intensity.. If you have anymore questions or concerns, this is the place to ask. I'm not trying to put you down in anyway, but training to make you ask yourself... Are you leaving it all in the gym?

    Matt
    I love this mindset... lol.
    "The only easy day was yesterday."

  13. #13
    Wanna Be BIG Joe B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ark94 View Post
    What are some good bodybuilding programs? I'll look around and see if i can find anything.
    HCT-12
    Meet PRs: Squat 455 / Bench 270 / Deadlift 525

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  14. #14
    Moderator Matthew Bryduck's Avatar
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    Scarz*of*Pain,

    I'm glad you enjoyed it... =)

    MAtt

  15. #15
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Matt would you be able to send me that ebook ? I'd appreciate it.

    And OP, I would re-consider doing HCT-12. To each his own, though.
    (Raw)
    Bench: 350
    Squat: 475
    Dead: 500

    "All people dream but not equally. Those who dream by night in the recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous ones, for they may act their dream with open eyes to make it possible."

  16. #16
    Moderator Matthew Bryduck's Avatar
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    Which ebook would you be referring too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Whoopipally View Post
    Matt would you be able to send me that ebook ? I'd appreciate it.

    And OP, I would re-consider doing HCT-12. To each his own, though.

  17. #17
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Bryduck View Post
    Which ebook would you be referring too?
    The Carb Backloading if you get a chance.
    (Raw)
    Bench: 350
    Squat: 475
    Dead: 500

    "All people dream but not equally. Those who dream by night in the recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous ones, for they may act their dream with open eyes to make it possible."

  18. #18
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    I would go with an upper/lower split routine for size and get your caloric intake higher.

    It doesn't even matter if you get a little bigger (with some fat) because you really need to get your strength levels up and pack some size.

  19. #19
    LuNa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whoopipally View Post
    The Carb Backloading if you get a chance.
    I would purchase the book from Kiefer's website. He has put the effort into doing all the research and writing the book, it would be wrong not to compensate him for that.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Jonathan E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNa View Post
    I would purchase the book from Kiefer's website. He has put the effort into doing all the research and writing the book, it would be wrong not to compensate him for that.
    Fair enough.
    (Raw)
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    Dead: 500

    "All people dream but not equally. Those who dream by night in the recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity; but the dreamers of the day are dangerous ones, for they may act their dream with open eyes to make it possible."

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