The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
Latest Article

The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Its no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
More Recent Articles
Contrast Training for Size
By: Lee Boyce
An Interview with Marianne Kane of Girls Gone Strong
By: Jordan Syatt
What Supplements Should I be Taking? By: Jay Wainwright
Bench Like a Girl By: Julia Ladewski
Some Thoughts on Building a Big Pull By: Christopher Mason

Facebook Join Facebook Group       Twitter Follow on Twitter       rss Subscribe via RSS
Results 1 to 20 of 20
  1. #1
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Westside Barbell, OH
    Posts
    8,920

    Pause Squats vs. Box Squat

    Had this discussion with Brandon Lilly the other day and I just wanted to see your all opinion here.

    Whats the difference and which is more beneficial and why?

    I just picked pause squats because they seem the be all the rage right now lol.


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Superior Athletics - Northeast Ohio's Center for Athlete Training
    *Westside Barbell Certified Gym

  2.    Support Wannabebig and use AtLarge Nutrition Supplements!


  3. #2
    A gallon a day, everyday! ThomasG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    3,713
    I do both, I am a raw wide squatter. I seem to have the best results doing Speed box squats against bands. Sometimes I'll do heavy pause squats and speed paused squats.
    My Journal
    Quote Originally Posted by Athos View Post
    you're an intelligent guy... but you're also half #$%&ing crazy... and that my friend is the formula for a great powerlifter.
    23 Years old
    5'10 198'er
    Squat-565(wraps) 560(Raw)
    Bench:365(raw)
    Deadlift:555(raw)
    Front Squat-465x1 (wraps) 405x2 (raw)
    AtLarge Nutrition Optimize your body and Support WBB

  4. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    2,486
    I bet the difference is pretty small if the box squat is done correctly. You see a lot of people that fall to the box, rock on the box, etc. If you're not getting coaching to break those habits, then you can get some really bad habits box squatting.
    www.wildirongym.com
    Become a fan of Wild Iron on Facebook:
    http://tinyurl.com/WildIron

  5. #4
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Westside Barbell, OH
    Posts
    8,920
    ^ This is definitely a key factor. Doing the box squat correctly is important.

    Although I will say I see a lot of guys doing paused squats and getting quite bent forward and resting most of the center of gravity over their knees.


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Superior Athletics - Northeast Ohio's Center for Athlete Training
    *Westside Barbell Certified Gym

  6. #5
    Become Unbreakable Mark!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Dallas Area, TX
    Posts
    3,628
    Just to clarify, proper box squatting is getting to the box, pausing and relaxing the hips and glutes, and then exploding off the box for the concentric phase correct?
    "Light Weight"

    260's by May

  7. #6
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Westside Barbell, OH
    Posts
    8,920
    It's releasing the hips. Not relaxing them. The glutes should stay tight.

    I know it sounds like a subtle difference but it makes a big difference.


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Superior Athletics - Northeast Ohio's Center for Athlete Training
    *Westside Barbell Certified Gym

  8. #7
    Moderator joey54's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Palmyra, PA
    Posts
    5,730
    Travis, what does Lou say on the matter?


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Just get under the bar!

  9. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    302
    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    It's releasing the hips. Not relaxing them. The glutes should stay tight.

    I know it sounds like a subtle difference but it makes a big difference.
    Can you elaborate? What do you mean by release?

    When we say hips what are we referring too?
    Keeping the glutes tense but relaxing the hip flexors?

  10. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    313
    They are completely different. I think they are both valuable though. I normally do 8x2 box squats but when I want to focus on the bottom end of the squat do 5x5 pause squats without accommodating resistance. Pause squats I feel more in my quads, but that's free squats in general.

  11. #10
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Westside Barbell, OH
    Posts
    8,920
    Quote Originally Posted by joey54 View Post
    Travis, what does Lou say on the matter?
    He feels that pause squats end up teaching you to be bent over in the hole as well as place an enormous amount of stress on the knees when done with a close stance.

    The box squat allows you to better train the hips hams and glutes, which are the primary muscles that will end up "catching" you in the hole, even raw. this is why more often than not we have seen guys in the gym hit bigger free squat numbers than they do off the box.


    Quote Originally Posted by RFabsik View Post
    Can you elaborate? What do you mean by release?

    When we say hips what are we referring too?
    Keeping the glutes tense but relaxing the hip flexors?

    When I say hips yes we mean the hip flexors. Releasing them means you sort of relax them. It's kinda hard to explain I guess but you half relax them while still driving your knees out as you come down on the box. When you begin to go up you don't roll back forward like you see some guys do. Or if you do, it should be very minimal.


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Superior Athletics - Northeast Ohio's Center for Athlete Training
    *Westside Barbell Certified Gym

  12. #11
    Moderator joey54's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Palmyra, PA
    Posts
    5,730
    So the next question Travis, and I ask this with all due respect, could Lilly's recent knee injury in anyway be attributed to some of the issues you mention regarding pause squats? It appeared he did them quite frequently in his training and was always vocal as to why he felt box squats did not work for him.


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Just get under the bar!

  13. #12
    Become Unbreakable Mark!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Dallas Area, TX
    Posts
    3,628
    Good question Joey, I'm interested in that answer as well. I personally try to stay away from pause squats at anything that's on the med/hvy side for me. I feel it wrecks me knees pretty badly, but lighter weight lower rep, I don't feel any issues.

    What is ya'lls opinion on dead stop squats from the hole? Time under tension wouldn't be near as bad as a pause squat and would give some carryover as to power out of the hole, albeit set up under the bar can be tough.
    "Light Weight"

    260's by May

  14. #13
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Westside Barbell, OH
    Posts
    8,920
    Quote Originally Posted by joey54 View Post
    So the next question Travis, and I ask this with all due respect, could Lilly's recent knee injury in anyway be attributed to some of the issues you mention regarding pause squats? It appeared he did them quite frequently in his training and was always vocal as to why he felt box squats did not work for him.
    A fair question but honestly an injury like that is so complicated I really don't know that you can attribute it to one thing. Honestly sometimes crap just lets go.

    I really think he just had a freak accident.

    The fundamental difference between Brandon and mine approach is what constitutes the most beneficial position in the hole. Brandon feels that pause squats teach better positioning in the squat, I don't but it's merely a difference of opinion.

    I'm not trying to direct this too much at Brandon or the Cube though. This was just something that crossed my mind the other day while squatting.


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Superior Athletics - Northeast Ohio's Center for Athlete Training
    *Westside Barbell Certified Gym

  15. #14
    Super Moderator vdizenzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    5,363
    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    It's releasing the hips. Not relaxing them. The glutes should stay tight.

    I know it sounds like a subtle difference but it makes a big difference.
    Thanks Trav, I was just working with my wife on this the other day. I told her just now about the glutes staying tight and that resonated with her. I'll see if I can't get her to relax them later


    Supplements I currently take: Nitrean , BCAA , Creatine 500 , Multi-Plus , Fish Oil

    My Training Log , My Youtube Videos

    "The weak will never understand" - Vincent Dizenzo

  16. #15
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Westside Barbell, OH
    Posts
    8,920
    LOL there ya go!


    AtLarge Nutrition Supplements Get the best supplements and help support Wannabebig!

    Superior Athletics - Northeast Ohio's Center for Athlete Training
    *Westside Barbell Certified Gym

  17. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    754
    I will say I had trained for a short time with a man that squats over 800 for reps with no belt or wraps and can squat over 900 with just a belt on, and had previously squatted high-1100s in multiply gear and over 1000 in single-ply gear in meets. His main thing he always did was pause squats. Ever since he trained even just for gear lifting, he would do beltless pause squats for triples after using gear. And since he has been training raw, his main squat movement almost always (other than close to a meet) is beltless pause squats, normally for triples, but sometimes sets between 2 and 5 reps. He always said that he believes these squats have been the number one thing in him being so successful at squatting. He also does not like box squats.

    I just wanted to share this opinion with you from someone I know is definitely one of the top dozen or so squatters in the world.
    Best competition lifts:
    650lbs. raw squat
    441lbs. raw bench
    580lbs. raw deadlift
    1650lbs. raw total

  18. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    754
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark! View Post
    Good question Joey, I'm interested in that answer as well. I personally try to stay away from pause squats at anything that's on the med/hvy side for me. I feel it wrecks me knees pretty badly, but lighter weight lower rep, I don't feel any issues.

    What is ya'lls opinion on dead stop squats from the hole? Time under tension wouldn't be near as bad as a pause squat and would give some carryover as to power out of the hole, albeit set up under the bar can be tough.
    I have done the dead stop ones starting from the bottom quite a bit a few years back. It was something I rotated in my training at the time. I could get maybe 30-40lbs. less on those than a regular squat, and I only did singles with them due to the setup. It is hard to setup under the bar though, and I thought that my hips came up faster at the beginning than with a regular squat. I think they are a useful addition, but not something I would do a lot as the main lift. Maybe once every month or longer when I did them. I would compare them to something like doing a box squat vs. regular squats or rack pulls or block pulls vs. a regular deadlift. Meaning they can help with that main lift but the movement pattern is slightly to moderately different so it shouldn't be practiced for long periods without doing the main lift. I know you talked about core stability and such though, and this may be another useful movement for you, because you have to stay really tight with them to get the weight moving and finish it.
    Best competition lifts:
    650lbs. raw squat
    441lbs. raw bench
    580lbs. raw deadlift
    1650lbs. raw total

  19. #18
    Gaglione Strength Chris Rodgers's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    9,267
    Quote Originally Posted by April Mathis View Post
    I will say I had trained for a short time with a man that squats over 800 for reps with no belt or wraps and can squat over 900 with just a belt on, and had previously squatted high-1100s in multiply gear and over 1000 in single-ply gear in meets. His main thing he always did was pause squats. Ever since he trained even just for gear lifting, he would do beltless pause squats for triples after using gear. And since he has been training raw, his main squat movement almost always (other than close to a meet) is beltless pause squats, normally for triples, but sometimes sets between 2 and 5 reps. He always said that he believes these squats have been the number one thing in him being so successful at squatting. He also does not like box squats.

    I just wanted to share this opinion with you from someone I know is definitely one of the top dozen or so squatters in the world.

    My buddy JB
    Best Meet Lifts(Raw w/wraps):
    @165- 435 SQ 270 BE 560 DL.....1255 total
    @181- 535 SQ 300 BE 570 DL.....1400 total
    Best Meet Lifts(Multi-ply):
    @148- 575 SQ 315 BE 515 DL.....1400 total
    @165- 680 SQ 380 BE 540 DL.....1555 total
    @181- 700 SQ 375 BE 535 DL.....1605 total
    Best Gym Lifts(Raw w/wraps)
    545 SQ 305 BE 585 DL

  20. #19
    Senior Member Niko_El_Piko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    Posts
    224
    I agree with the theory of Brandon, about Pause Squats and Box sq.

    The main difference here, I work every week with regular squats, and I believe that both (paused & BOx) are accesory work.
    I work Pause Squats on a 3-5 range every 2 weeks. I think the give a solid foundation getting out of the hole (specially RAW).
    In the case of the Box Squats, I used to love them, but I dont use them any more as a main lift. I'll go for reps and take it a great work for hams & glutes. Also as speed work.

  21. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    303
    I can squat probably not even half of what you can. So, according to my expert analysis, my opinion doesn't mean shit in this thread.

Similar Threads

  1. 7 second pause squat with 460lbs. [1 rep]
    By Matteo Paolo in forum Members' Pics and Videos
    Replies: 46
    Last Post: 03-14-2012, 07:41 AM
  2. Box squats vs Pause squats...
    By bojackson in forum Powerlifting and Strength Training
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-16-2010, 07:26 AM
  3. Box Squat ?s: low vs mid height, pause vs no pause?
    By samadhi_smiles in forum Powerlifting and Strength Training
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 06-16-2009, 08:33 AM
  4. Phil Harrington 850 pause squat on chains
    By Lil Mendy in forum Powerlifting and Strength Training
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 06-15-2009, 03:43 PM
  5. 910 pause squat on chains
    By Lil Mendy in forum Powerlifting and Strength Training
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 07-06-2004, 06:28 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •