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Thread: HST workout, too long?

  1. #1
    The Tuna Tempter
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    HST workout, too long?

    I've been testing for my maxes...and I feel like i really can't be bothered doing 14 sets. I'm not used to doing this much...I usually do about 12...but not all the big lifts in one day. For my HST I'll be doing:
    bench press
    squats
    DB overhead press
    SLDL
    lateral side raises
    DL
    BB calve raises
    BB shrugs
    one arm DB rows
    triceps extension
    standing EZ bar curls
    lat pulldown/pullups
    weighted decline crunches

    I do 1 set of each.

    Is this too much for HST? What can I do to not feel so lazy and drained out? Last max test day I drank some pepsi, and today I had 600ml of orange juice...this made me feel a bit better. But what else would really rev me up?
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  2. #2
    fat and small Blood&Iron's Avatar
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    Re: HST workout, too long?

    Well, I certainly thing DL'ing, squatting, and SLDL'ing all in one workout is way too much. Also, perhaps I'm simply not seeing it, but the order in which you've placed your exercises, doens't really seems to have any rhyme or reason. You could alternate the squatt and DL at every other workout and drop some of the isolation exercises so you have A and B workouts for something like:

    A)
    Squat
    SLDL
    Bench Press
    lat pulldown/pullups
    DB overhead press
    one arm DB rows
    standing EZ bar curls
    BB shrugs
    BB calve raises
    weighted decline crunches

    B)
    DL
    Bench Press
    lat pulldown/pullups
    lateral side raises
    one arm DB rows
    standing EZ bar curls
    BB shrugs
    BB calve raises
    weighted decline crunches

    Also, drinking a dilute carb drink, e.g. Gatorade, during your workout might help with the fatigue.

    Just thoughts.

    We tend to think of Sisyphus as a tragic hero, condemned by the gods to shoulder his rock sweatily up the mountain, and again up the mountain, forever. The truth is that Sisyphus is in love with the rock. He cherishes every roughness and every ounce of it. He talks to it, sings to it. It has become the mysterious Other. He even dreams of it as he sleepwalks upward. Life is unimaginable without it, looming always above him like a huge gray moon. He doesn’t realize that at any moment he is permitted to step aside, let the rock hurtle to the bottom, and go home.

    Parables and Portraits, Stephen Mitchell

  3. #3
    The Tuna Tempter
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    Blood&Iron, thanks for your reply mate.

    I was thinking of doing this...but is this still sticking within the boundaries of HST? HST specifies a muscle to be worked frequently with sub maximal weights. If i'm alternating a and b, i may do mon-a, wed-b, fri-a. So I'd be only doing deads once a week, so lower back only gets a real workout once a week.

    Tell me if I'm wrong.

    Also..how come you chose to leave out triceps extension, but included EZ bar curls? Don't you think that the tri's deserve more attention as they are a larger muscle..and the bi's already get a lot of work with DB rows and la pulldown/pullups.
    I really want to perfect my workout so that I'm not doing any uneccessary work that will not benefit me

    Thanks alot for your input B&I
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  4. #4
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    Why do SLDL and DL? Almost the same exercise. I tried doing both and it just wasn't worth it. SLDL help my DL, so I just throw in some singles from time to time.

    The A/B split B&I suggested is still proper HST. It's not a fixed in stone way of training. You can adapt it to what you want to do as long as you remain true to the HST "principles".

  5. #5
    The Tuna Tempter
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    yeh, i guess so MP.

    SLDL and DL are no way almost same man. SLDL targets the hammies, and DL hits lower back and quads and traps. Two totally diff exercises I say, don't let the common word of deadlift fool u.
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  6. #6
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    tank, they are very similar with the exception of the amount of quad work involved, in fact, they can be almost identical depending on your DL form.

  7. #7
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    the quad is still involved in the lift in the stiff-legged variety, it just serves a somewhat different function. It still gets worked though.

  8. #8
    The Tuna Tempter
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    ehhh....i wouldn't say so much it gets worked. obviously it serves some kind of function...but i don't think you could really say it gets 'worked'.
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  9. #9
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    irregardless, I hope you're not doing deads for your quads! the lower back work is essentially identical. no need to do both.

    Anway, DL's are best done as singles off the floor IMO.

  10. #10
    The Tuna Tempter
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    nah, i'm doing the deads for the lower back. I agree that the SLDL does work the lower back also...but not to the extent of the DL. With SLDL the lower back is more of a secondary kind of muscle i think.

    I'm off to bed mate...i'll get back to this post thread 2morrow
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  11. #11
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    you could be right tank, but it seems the lower back goes through a greater range of motion on the SLDL.

    anyway, to answer your other question about workload: you'll adjust. I only do 10-11 sets on HST, but even that was more than the 6-8 sets a workout that I was doing before. BTW - the 15's are always a killer, in fact, they just keep getting worse for me!

  12. #12
    fat and small Blood&Iron's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Tank23
    Blood&Iron, thanks for your reply mate.

    I was thinking of doing this...but is this still sticking within the boundaries of HST? HST specifies a muscle to be worked frequently with sub maximal weights. If i'm alternating a and b, i may do mon-a, wed-b, fri-a. So I'd be only doing deads once a week, so lower back only gets a real workout once a week.

    Tell me if I'm wrong.
    Well, it'll only get worked once the first week, but twice the 2nd(where you'll go mon-b wed-a fri-b) and so on. Besides, on the other days you're still hitting lower back with squats and the SLDL. In fact, I merely left in the DL because it was in your original routine. From my experience, it'd probably be better to choose EITHER the squat OR the DL, and do leg presses on the alternate days to give your low back a rest. I tried squatting three times a week my first time out with HST and it was, for me, a bit much.


    Also..how come you chose to leave out triceps extension, but included EZ bar curls? Don't you think that the tri's deserve more attention as they are a larger muscle..and the bi's already get a lot of work with DB rows and la pulldown/pullups.
    I really want to perfect my workout so that I'm not doing any uneccessary work that will not benefit me
    Personally, I'm a firm believer that the triceps get a ton of work from the various pressing movements, but that biceps, while hit by rows, chins, etc aren't worked quite as hard and need a bit of extra stimulation. It's a judgment call. You could probably be fine with dropping the curls, or with adding the extensions back in.


    Thanks alot for your input B&I
    Happy to help.
    Last edited by Blood&Iron; 07-30-2002 at 08:48 AM.

    We tend to think of Sisyphus as a tragic hero, condemned by the gods to shoulder his rock sweatily up the mountain, and again up the mountain, forever. The truth is that Sisyphus is in love with the rock. He cherishes every roughness and every ounce of it. He talks to it, sings to it. It has become the mysterious Other. He even dreams of it as he sleepwalks upward. Life is unimaginable without it, looming always above him like a huge gray moon. He doesn’t realize that at any moment he is permitted to step aside, let the rock hurtle to the bottom, and go home.

    Parables and Portraits, Stephen Mitchell

  13. #13
    The Tuna Tempter
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    ok B&I, i think your suggestion is very good. I will try cycliing workouts a and b. I may think about omitting DL, but I really like doing them.
    and I may also think about alternating bicep curls with tricep extentions....how does this sound? I'll still be sticking to HST by doing this, right? Since HST is highly customizable....

    Thanks
    -John
    Life's too short to be small

  14. #14
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    I think once the idea of doing your whole body becomes familiar

    you will find relief in the that each muscle packs a bit of it's own juice

    I have never tried HST but I have done an Upper body day and at first it seemed way too hard until I realized the systemic fatigue from the first few exercises dosen't mean your remaining parts are not somewhat fresh (wow I'm tired and rambling now)

    Also Deads and SLDL is one of my favourite leg routines
    I use only my quads to make the bar break the floor and then as the bar speed increases I stand up

    the SLDL afterwards really fried my Hams, glutes and low back

    I know deads aren't really a quad exercise but I think they can be made into one with a conscious effort

    Good luck with HST Tank

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  15. #15
    The Tuna Tempter
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    Thanks alot Holto! I've decided to alternate the big compound movements. Just like B&I suggested I will alternate between workout A and workout B.

    ..and Holto...yeh I think it's somewhat just a matter of getting used to the increased volume. Overall you feel fairly fatigued..but yes..the non worked muscles still feel fresh.
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  16. #16
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    Tank,

    Don't get me wrong here, but what's your obsession with your lower back?

    Squats and SLDL will strengthen it enough.

    I mean it's not like it's a visually noticeable body part.

    How often do you hear someone say, "Wow, check out the lower back on that guy!"?

    While I'm at it, I do a total of 15 sets within my HST training, and it's not too long.
    Bear <><

  17. #17
    The Tuna Tempter
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    lol@obadiah. I don't train my lower back for the look of it mate. I get lower back pain...and I need to strengthen my lower back and possibly abs.
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  18. #18
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    Originally posted by Tank23
    lol@obadiah. I don't train my lower back for the look of it mate. I get lower back pain...and I need to strengthen my lower back and possibly abs.
    Gotcha!

    I've been diagnosed with an arthritic condition in my lower back as well.
    Bear <><

  19. #19
    The Tuna Tempter
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    yeh? how does it affect your training?
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  20. #20
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    Originally posted by Tank23
    yeh? how does it affect your training?
    As long as I warm-up and stretch it a little before hand, I have no problems.
    Bear <><

  21. #21
    The Tuna Tempter
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    ohh that must be a pain in the ass...but at least you can still train eh
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  22. #22
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    If you have lower back problems, you have a pretty good chance of aggravating them while doing HST. You'll be hitting that area three times a week. By the time you realize you've strained an area, it will be too late, and it will take a long time to recover. I made the mistake of doing grip work 3x a week on HST and it took me almost three months to comletely recover from it.

    I would suggest alternating squats and BLDLs. Ditch the SLDLs completley while you're doing HST.

    I would also ditch the lateral raises. The DB overhead press will be plenty if you're doing them 3x a week.

    Also, ditch the triceps extensions. Bench presses and DB overhead presses done 3x a week will give your triceps plenty of work.
    Last edited by Delphi; 07-31-2002 at 05:33 PM.

  23. #23
    The Tuna Tempter
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    Delphi mate!: you sound like you know what you're talking about. If it's not too much trouble..could you please list all the exercises you'd recommend I do on HST?

    Thanks
    -John
    Life's too short to be small

  24. #24
    . Delphi's Avatar
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    Gotta go to work now. I'll reply this evening.

    (That's pretty dicey of you, assuming I know what I'm talking about. )
    Last edited by Delphi; 08-01-2002 at 05:15 AM.

  25. #25
    The Tuna Tempter
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    lol, i don't know what ur talking about
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