Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 37 of 37

Thread: New Routine

  1. #26
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Vancouver, B.C.
    Posts
    5,323
    Cack said,
    Yes, i guess it was a theoretical question. It's a sensible question, though. Just answer that question from a strictly physiological standpoint


    *** I would guess that all the fibres would be stimulated in that particular movement. But if you did two sets using two different exercises the stimulation of muscle fiobres would be greater than just doing one exercise.
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  2. #27
    Senior Member flake's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Posts
    800
    I've performed simple experiments attempting to identify under what circumstances does the failure occur: at the neuronal level, or at the fibril level.

    Wouldn't the site of failure make a difference?
    half the time I have no idea what you're talking about. the other half, I'm not listening.

  3. #28
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Vancouver, B.C.
    Posts
    5,323
    Flake said,
    I've performed simple experiments attempting to identify under what circumstances does the failure occur: at the neuronal level, or at the fibril level


    *** Do you mean neural and muscular?
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  4. #29
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Moisturizing kimpy's face.
    Posts
    2,744
    "But if you did two sets using two different exercises the stimulation of muscle fiobres would be greater than just doing one exercise."

    Increased muscle fiber stimulation does not mean that more muscle growth will occur. What I'm getting at, is that this extra stimulation may not be necessary. Why wouldn't one set to failure be as effective as multiple sets not to failure?

  5. #30
    Senior Member flake's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Posts
    800
    "Do you mean neural and muscular?"

    yep
    half the time I have no idea what you're talking about. the other half, I'm not listening.

  6. #31
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Vancouver, B.C.
    Posts
    5,323
    Cack said,
    Increased muscle fiber stimulation does not mean that more muscle growth will occur. What I'm getting at, is that this extra stimulation may not be necessary. Why wouldn't one set to failure be as effective as multiple sets not to failure?

    *** You are asking a hypothetical question, one set to failure could be effective as several sets not taken to failure but you would have to keep in mind that the other variables would have to be up to par. Rarely is this the case. It has been shown that higher volume is effective for hypertrophy. It's stated in Tudor Bompas book, "Periodization" and his book called, "Serious Strength Training ".

    Flake said,
    Wouldn't the site of failure make a difference

    *** Make a difference in what? Can you be more specific?
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  7. #32
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Posts
    12,706
    You guys are missing something here, the nervous system never "fails" during weightlifting. When one fails to complete a rep in weightlifting, the muscles are still receiving neural stimulation, they are just not capable of momentarily contracting hard enough to lift the weight.

  8. #33
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Vancouver, B.C.
    Posts
    5,323
    Originally posted by chris mason
    You guys are missing something here, the nervous system never "fails" during weightlifting. When one fails to complete a rep in weightlifting, the muscles are still receiving neural stimulation, they are just not capable of momentarily contracting hard enough to lift the weight.
    *** What is responsible for the ability of the muscle to contract hard enough to lift the weight?
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  9. #34
    Senior Member flake's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Posts
    800
    chris: failure can occur at the neurone, literally in the past month I've been researching into this. When a muscle is artificially stimulated in the lab and it fails, under certain circumstances it's possible to continue to achieve a response from the muscle by direct stimulation using an electrode. Surely this implies that the neurones at least can 'fail'.
    half the time I have no idea what you're talking about. the other half, I'm not listening.

  10. #35
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Posts
    12,706
    Ok boys, time for a discussion in physiology. First, when a muscle fails during weightlifting, it is still receiving neural stimulation. The reason it fails has nothing to do with the neural input, it is due to the following factors taken from Human Anatomy and Physiology by Elaine N. Marieb:

    Muscle fatigue is a state of physiological inability to contract (or contract forcefully enough to get the job done--Chris).... Notice that muscle fatigue results from a relative deficit of ATP, not its total absence. When no ATP is available, contractures, or states of continuous contraction, result because the cross bridges are unable to detach (not unlike the scenario of rigor mortis)......
    Other contributors to muscle fatigue include excessive accumulation of lactic acid and ionic imbalances, Lactic acid, which causes muscle pH to drop (and the muscles to ache), causes extreme fatigue, which limits the usefulness of the anaerobic mehanism for ATP production. During transmission of action potentials, potassium is lost from the muscle cells, and excess sodium enters. So long as ATP is available to energize the Na+ -K+ pump, these slight ionic imbalances are corrected. However, without ATP, the pump is inactive, and ionic imbalances finally cause the muscle cells to become non-responsive to stimulation.

    Ok, now, when you fail during weightlifting, it is not because the muscle has failed to contract, the contraction has merely become isometric in nature. In other words, your muscles are spinning their wheels. The tension created by the muscle is no longer great enough to move the load, even with a maximal recruitment of motor units by the nervous system. When you do fail, you have not completely exhausted the muscle as decribed above in the excerpt, rather, you have reached a point where due to lack of ATP, or buildup of lactic acid, the muscle cells being recruited by the nervous system are no longer able to contract forcefully enough to move the load. You have not completely exhausted the muscle, because you are still able to contract your muscles, just not enough to do the job. For instance, you may be able to lift 200lbs, just not the 225lbs you are attempting for the 10th rep.

    By the way Flake, what are neurones? I think you mean neurons. Additionally, we are talking about in vivo things here (actual weightlifting), not artficially produced lab results.

  11. #36
    Geordie The_Chicken_Daddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Grace
    Posts
    6,187
    Neurones and neurons are the same thing according to the dictionary.

    I'll admit that until today I'd never heard of neurons, but i have heard of neurones.
    "Geordie/'d3c:di/n. & adj. Brit colloq. n. 1 a native of Tyneside. 2 the dialect spoken on Tyneside. adj. of or relating to Tyneside, its people, or its dialect. [the name George + -IE]

  12. #37
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Posts
    12,706
    Must be an English spelling! Seriously! I have never heard of them being referred to as neurones.

Similar Threads

  1. Questions About Possible New Routine (HST) - Please Help
    By Harrison486 in forum Bodybuilding & Weight Training
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 06-07-2004, 06:56 PM
  2. Please critique my routine
    By mike107 in forum Bodybuilding & Weight Training
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06-05-2004, 02:10 PM
  3. Any suggestions on my routine?
    By JUICE in forum Bodybuilding & Weight Training
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 03-25-2004, 01:50 AM
  4. New Workout routine Help!
    By TexasAggie in forum Bodybuilding & Weight Training
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 01-08-2004, 10:59 PM
  5. reccommended routine
    By undrcnstruction in forum Bodybuilding & Weight Training
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 07-10-2002, 10:58 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •