The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
Latest Article

The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
More Recent Articles
Contrast Training for Size
By: Lee Boyce
An Interview with Marianne Kane of Girls Gone Strong
By: Jordan Syatt
What Supplements Should I be Taking? By: Jay Wainwright
Bench Like a Girl By: Julia Ladewski
Some Thoughts on Building a Big Pull By: Christopher Mason

Facebook Join Facebook Group       Twitter Follow on Twitter       rss Subscribe via RSS
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 60
  1. #1
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093

    Old-School 5x5 Routine.. Worthy Or Worthless?

    I know that some of you guys here @ WBB have tried this routine for yourself, and some of you have thoughts on it etc.

    I just read about a few guys who did this routine with great success. What do you guys think about 5x5?

  2.    Support Wannabebig and use AtLarge Nutrition Supplements!


  3. #2
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Here is a description of 5x5.

    The 5x5 Training Method

    Originally developed by Reg Park, the 5x5 method involves doing 5 sets of 5 reps, using the same resistance. That's the goal. However, if you've chosen the proper weight, you won't be able to do 5 sets of 5, at least not right away.

    Typically, if you've chosen the correct weight, the workout would look like this:

    Set 1: 5x100 pounds
    Set 2: 4x100 pounds
    Set 3: 3x100 pounds
    Set 4: 3x100 pounds
    Set 5: 2x100 pounds

    Remember, the goal of doing 5 sets of 5 reps is a hypothetical goal. If you can do 5 sets of 5 right off the bat, the weight you've chosen is too light.
    It seems like a worthy routine. I think so at least. Focusing on progression, etc.

  4. #3
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Maybe something like this for my split.

    PUSH.
    Flat BB Press 5 x 5
    Dips 5 x 5
    One-arm Laterals 2 x 6-8
    Skullcrushers 5 x 5

    PULL.
    WG Chins 5 x 5
    One-arm DB Rows 5 x 5
    Shrugs 2 x 6-8
    BB Curls 5 x 5
    Hammers 2 x 6-8

    LEGS.
    Squats 5 x 5
    Leg Presses 2 x 6-8
    Goodmornings 5 x 5
    Calf Raises 5 x 5


  5. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Kalamazoo,MI
    Posts
    166
    I think it is vastly underated.The 5x5 system is what a majority of trainees used with great success back in the day.Great for size and strength gains IMO.Here's another take on it from a knowledgeable fellow:

    http://www.olympus.net/personal/cablebar/5X5.htm



    (Works now- the X in 5X5 had to be capitalized.)
    Last edited by Delphi; 08-11-2002 at 07:37 AM.
    "I figure, f*ck it.While I'm at it, why not just shoot my buddy.Take his job.Give it to his sworn enemy.Hike up gas prices.Bomb a village.Club a baby seal.Hit the hash pipe and join the national guard.I could be elected president."

  6. #5
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Originally posted by ballast
    I think it is vastly underated.The 5x5 system is what a majority of trainees used with great success back in the day.Great for size and strength gains IMO.Here's another take on it from a knowledgeable fellow:

    http://www.olympus.net/personal/cablebar/5x5.htm
    That link doesnt work ballast, you might want to check it.

    Yeah I have been reading up on it a lot and it seems like a great way to train. Once you get 5 sets of 5 you increase the workload. Seems to focus on progression, etc. Looks like a solid program. I think that WBB member Natedogg has had good success with it.

    I believe it originated in the 1940's or something like that when Reg Park stated it. Then Bill Starr included it in one of this books or something like that. I could be wrong with this info.
    Last edited by MonStar; 08-10-2002 at 09:45 AM.

  7. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    232
    I myself am going to try the 5x5 method, as I've been reading a lot of Pavel Tsatsouline, and that is one of the types of workouts he reccomends.

  8. #7
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    seanilles, where do you find some his writings? I am curious to read more about 5x5 and all I have really found is some stuff at T-mag.com which isnt all that accurate or valuable I dont think. Charles Poliquin has a few articles where he likes 5x5.

  9. #8
    "Tuna Boy" NateDogg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Central, MA
    Posts
    3,376
    Yup. I love it. I am actually just now switchin to a 8-10 rep routine geared more towards hypertrophy. 5X5 training, much like how my journal started out, caused my weight and strength to increase like nothing else has ever done for me (coupled with eating and resting a lot of course). My 5X5 was a little different than Park's. I took my method from needsize over at elite. Basically, two warm-up sets with 50-65% 5 rep max weight, then three working sets with 5 rep max weight. Of course I did not always get 5 reps out of the last three sets, but it worked fine for me. That would be for the major, compound lifts (deads, squats presses) then I threw in some assistance work, 3 sets with a higher rep range. I would have to recommend 5X5 training, just because it worked for me. Of course, everyone is different, but you never know until you try it!

    HTH,

    ND
    "damn...can't beat logic like that.
    NAte is exactly right." - Tryska

  10. #9
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Thanks NateDogg. Does my routine look okay to you, its a few posts up. Yeah needsize from Elite seems to be roided up but he claims to have gotten incredible results from 5x5 before he started anabolics. Its not like hes the only one getting results with 5x5 anyway. But yeah I would do 5x5 for curls and skulls too, and calf raises to bring them up.

  11. #10
    "Tuna Boy" NateDogg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Central, MA
    Posts
    3,376
    Originally posted by MonStar
    Maybe something like this for my split.

    PUSH.
    Flat BB Press 5 x 5
    Dips 5 x 5
    One-arm Laterals 2 x 6-8
    Skullcrushers 5 x 5

    PULL.
    WG Chins 5 x 5
    One-arm DB Rows 5 x 5
    Shrugs 2 x 6-8
    BB Curls 5 x 5
    Hammers 2 x 6-8

    LEGS.
    Squats 5 x 5
    Leg Presses 2 x 6-8
    Goodmornings 5 x 5
    Calf Raises 5 x 5

    I would make a couple changes based on my experience. I would do dips before BB presses, just because dips took more out of me that my DB presses. I also believe that there is more of an opportunity for shoulder injury in dips so I want to be 100% when I do those. I might also drop those hammer curls, just see how you feel at the end of the workout! Overall that looks solid though
    "damn...can't beat logic like that.
    NAte is exactly right." - Tryska

  12. #11
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Okay thanks ND. Well see what happens. I dont know what I want to do yet. I might even do dips followed by incline BB presses. Because I am currently not doing any OH pressing.

  13. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Kalamazoo,MI
    Posts
    166
    "I figure, f*ck it.While I'm at it, why not just shoot my buddy.Take his job.Give it to his sworn enemy.Hike up gas prices.Bomb a village.Club a baby seal.Hit the hash pipe and join the national guard.I could be elected president."

  14. #13
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Thanks ballast. Going to quote that link actually.

    THREE APPROACHES!!!
    1. Light weight for speed: 5 sets of 5 reps with no more than 60 seconds rest between sets. 60% to 65% of your 1 RM. is recommended. NOTE: It's important that you move the weight a fast as possible with 100% effort on each rep. Maximum bar velocity is important to get the optimum use of your fast twitch muscle fibers.

    2. Medium weight: 5 to 6 sets of 5 to 6 reps. Work up over the first 2 to 3 sets, then do 2 to 3 sets of with the same work weight. 75% to 85% is recommended.

    3. Heaviest weight: 5 to 6 sets working up to limit "all-out" set of 3 to 5 reps on the last set. 85% to 95% is recommended.

    I've used all three of these approaches to the 5X5 principle for many years and have found them to be ideal for trainees to train compound movements. However, I don't recommend this for "multiple compound" movements (Olympic lifts)

    Try doing the same compound movement twice in one week with one of each from the 3 choices above.

    FOR A CYCLE: Try doing one "light/speed" workout and then on another day do one "medium" workout. Do this for two weeks. Then on the third week do a "light to medium" workout one day and on second workout go for that "limit set" of 3 to 5 reps.

    Let's assume you're training the Squat and your 1RM is 300 lb..

    If you're doing a light/ speed workout, you would use 180 lb. to 195 lb.. Start with a light weight, let's say 135 lb., and do 10 to 12 reps for a warm up. Increase your speed progressively faster and faster on the last 4 to 5 reps.

    Now put your 60% to 65% (180 to 195) on the bar and do 5 sets of 5 reps with no more than 60 seconds rest between sets, and do each rep like there was 300 lb. on the bar.

    If you're doing a "medium" weight workout use 75% to 85%. That's 225 to 255. Start with 135 for 10 to 12 reps. Then go 185X5, 225X5, and finish with 255 for 2 to 3 sets. Or if you're not feeling 100% that day, just do the 225 for 3 sets of 5.

    On a "heavy" workout day, you would use between 255 and 285 lb.. To progress up do something like 135X10 reps, 185X5, 225X5, 255X5, 280X5. If you can get that 280 for 5, then try 290 to 300 and try to get at least a triple. If you can get 290 for 3 reps or better, you can pretty much estimate a higher 1RM. without actually doing that 1RM.

    This is a good way to train both front and back squats, as well as most pressing movements, Bench, Incline, and Seated Presses.

  15. #14
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    I also want to shoot for PBs so I am thinking that the last week in every month or something Ill test my 1RMs for the exercises in my signature. Maybe max out and then follow up with my regular 5x5 workout or something like that. This is generally a strength program correct?

    I am expecting great results with it. Days 1-30 of my journal were basically me f*cking around with different routines and diets and now I am just going to stick with a basic bodybuilding diet and basic 5x5 training routine.

  16. #15
    Bodybuilding Mythbuster
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Yeongsan. South Korea
    Posts
    5,907
    A 5 x 5 program sounds very promising. I've had my best gains with a program similar to that. How long are the rest periods in between these sets? Are you going to do all three approaches (light, medium, and heavy)or stick with just one?

  17. #16
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Originally posted by ExtremeAnabolic
    A 5 x 5 program sounds very promising. I've had my best gains with a program similar to that. How long are the rest periods in between these sets? Are you going to do all three approaches (light, medium, and heavy)or stick with just one?
    I am not going to be doing the light, medium, and heavy, no. Only because okay for example lets look at an exercise that I performed yesterday. Dips for example. Here is what my sets looked like:

    +75 x 5 (not to failure)
    +75 x 5 (not to failure)
    +75 x 5 (not to failure)
    +75 x 5 (failure)
    +75 x 4 (failure)

    So out of 5 working sets only two of those working sets are to failure. I doubt my CNS will be overworked with such a program. Anyway I am glad that you like the 5x5 routine EA. Its always nice to hear good things about the routine that youre doing.

  18. #17
    Baby Seal Clubber ElPietro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    12,778
    So you are changing again? You are the most clueless member on this site. Newbies who think they are training the outer upper pec will have more success than you because they can at least do something for a continuous period of time. With your lack of clear thought I'm surprised you haven't killed yourself in the gym doing something stupid.
    Deadlifts are like women, they'll hurt you everytime, but they'll also make you a man. - Me

    Friends don't let friends do dumbell kickbacks. - Me

    ElP is the smartest man in the world. - Gyno Rhino

    A low voter turnout is an indication of fewer people going to the polls. -- Dan Quayle

    If do right, no can defense. -- Mr. Miyagi

    Deep Thoughts by Jack Handey:

    I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.

    Is there anything more beautiful than a beautiful, beautiful flamingo, flying across in front of a beautiful sunset? And he's carrying a beautiful rose in his beak, and also he's carrying a very beautiful painting with his feet. And also, you're drunk.

    Current FFFA Enforcer

  19. #18
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Thanks EP, appreciate your support and thoughts about 5x5.

  20. #19
    Geordie The_Chicken_Daddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Grace
    Posts
    6,187
    LMAO.
    "Geordie/'d3c:di/n. & adj. Brit colloq. n. 1 a native of Tyneside. 2 the dialect spoken on Tyneside. adj. of or relating to Tyneside, its people, or its dialect. [the name George + -IE]

  21. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Tel Aviv, Israel
    Posts
    1,076
    I think it is a good affective method for both strength and stamina, good luck.
    Stats
    5'10,185-190lbs, 12-16%bf

  22. #21
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Originally posted by Black_Curtain
    I think it is a good affective method for both strength and stamina, good luck.
    Thanks a lot BC appreciate it man. Thanks for staying on the subject of the 5x5 routine too. Again yeah Ill be keeping my usual journal you can check it out if you like to see how I progress.

  23. #22
    Senior Member Manveet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    White Rock, BC
    Posts
    5,774
    You do change things up alot Monstar, but then again your a pretty big guy imo. Last time I remember you were doin a "back to the basics" type routine, dunno if you still are. But, if you switch to 5x5 I don't think it's too far off from that last routine. Good luck.
    "It is often said, mainly by the "no-contests", that although there is no positive evidence for the existence of God, nor is there evidence against his existence. So it is best to keep an open mind and be agnostic. At first sight that seems an unassailable position, at least in the weak sense of Pascal's wager. But on second thought it seems a cop-out, because the same could be said of Father Christmas and tooth fairies. There may be fairies at the bottom of the garden. There is no evidence for it, but you can't prove that there aren't any, so shouldn't we be agnostic with respect to fairies?"

    Richard Dawkins


    "Out of all of the sects in the world, we notice an uncanny coincidence: the overwhelming majority just happen to choose the one that their parents belong to. Not the sect that has the best evidence in its favour, the best miracles, the best moral code, the best cathedral, the best stained glass, the best music: when it comes to choosing from the smorgasbord of available religions, their potential virtues seem to count for nothing, compared to the matter of heredity. This is an unmistakable fact; nobody could seriously deny it. Yet people with full knowledge of the arbitrary nature of this heredity, somehow manage to go on believing in their religion, often with such fanaticism that they are prepared to murder people who follow a different one."


    Richard Dawkins


    "Bah. You know I hate poor people."

    Paul Stagg

  24. #23
    Mike Henley MonStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,093
    Originally posted by Manveet
    You do change things up alot Monstar, but then again your a pretty big guy imo. Last time I remember you were doin a "back to the basics" type routine, dunno if you still are. But, if you switch to 5x5 I don't think it's too far off from that last routine. Good luck.
    Yeah Manveet I was and am still doing a back to the basics diet and training split. The only thing I have modified is my rep scheme. First I did some heavy and light workouts and now I am just going to go with something simple and basic, 5x5.

  25. #24
    Gettin Lean Goin_Big's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    U.S.A.
    Posts
    1,719
    I'd luv to be able to agree with LP on this, but you are huge. Life is so confusing, lmfao.
    Beachbody coaching lets you turn your hobby into a career - Beachbody

  26. #25
    Senior Member Meat_Head's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    3,315
    Its true many have used the 5x5 routine with great results.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but most 5x5 routines are only focused on 1 or 2 or 3 major exercises I believe. Seems like using it on almost all of your sets might be pushing overtraining eventually, but I'm sure you'll see great results. If I were you, I'd only use 5x5 on the bench press, chins, and squats, and lower the intensity and volume on some of the other exercises.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •