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Thread: The Mind in Lifting...

  1. #26
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    There are limits, despite what you may feel Go Pro you will never reach 400 pounds. Maybe being a fat lump of tissue. My point is, it really depends on what your body is capable of.

    I understand and I agree with most of your points but simply saying I can do anything and then setting out to acomplish this, is an illusion. I never thought I'd weigh over 200 pounds but as much as I want I will never be able to weigh 300 pounds at 18% without drugs. So my limits do have a horizon.

    Sure I believe in mind over matter but you're mistaken if you think that anyone can set out and acomplish an unrealistic goal.
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    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  2. #27
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Just call me 'friggin Barney

  3. #28
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    People can surprise themselves. Maybe goal setting long term isn't what you need. It's like climbing a windy mountain path, surrounded by trees. All you see is the endless path in front of you, all you can think about is the next turn, the next rock to climb over, the next ditch to avoid. But the whole time, you know you're climbing higher and higher. You may not be able to tell by looking behind you... all you remember is more of the same road, perhaps closer to the ground, but more of the same anyway.

    Then, every now and then, you see a break in the trees, and you get the chance to pause and look down. Then you really see how far you've come.

    It's not about making a beeline for the top. It's not even about visualizing the top, really. It's about the journey. The next step, the next turn. You know you're leaving other travelers behind if you keep walking, so it doesn't matter how many are ahead of you. Every step you take takes you farther and farther from the crowd in the foothills. You may never stand on the summit, but regardless of how high you get, you'll have made the journey.

    That's all it's about. A year ago, I wouldn't have believed I could have deadlifted 535. I didn't think about it. I was working on pulling 405. That's all that mattered to me. If you enjoy the journey, enjoy every small challenge, and every now and then take a look down without obsessing over how far you've yet to go, you'll keep progressing.
    "Except Belial. He knows everything. This isn't a sarcastic attack, either. He really knows everything." -----Organichu
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  4. #29
    bone crusher
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    well said man

  5. #30
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Let me put it this way, I know I can't get as big as a guy using steroids with similar genetics and work ethic. I know I can't be as strong. If I believe that steroids create a superhuman state, and I do because I have used them personally, then I know I can't compete with someone who has similar genetics and work ethic. I am not naive enough to believe that my genetics and worth ethic are better than every pro bodybuilder today, or from 20-30 years ago. Therefore, I must conclude that I cannot attain their level of development naturally. Therefore, I have a set ceiling as to what I can attain.

  6. #31
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Belial
    People can surprise themselves. Maybe goal setting long term isn't what you need. It's like climbing a windy mountain path, surrounded by trees. All you see is the endless path in front of you, all you can think about is the next turn, the next rock to climb over, the next ditch to avoid. But the whole time, you know you're climbing higher and higher. You may not be able to tell by looking behind you... all you remember is more of the same road, perhaps closer to the ground, but more of the same anyway.

    Then, every now and then, you see a break in the trees, and you get the chance to pause and look down. Then you really see how far you've come.

    It's not about making a beeline for the top. It's not even about visualizing the top, really. It's about the journey. The next step, the next turn. You know you're leaving other travelers behind if you keep walking, so it doesn't matter how many are ahead of you. Every step you take takes you farther and farther from the crowd in the foothills. You may never stand on the summit, but regardless of how high you get, you'll have made the journey.

    That's all it's about. A year ago, I wouldn't have believed I could have deadlifted 535. I didn't think about it. I was working on pulling 405. That's all that mattered to me. If you enjoy the journey, enjoy every small challenge, and every now and then take a look down without obsessing over how far you've yet to go, you'll keep progressing.
    *** Well said. This is what bodybuilding, lifting weights, strength training or whatever you may call it is all about. But, although the journey is what makes the person it is still the dream that gets them started. Their goal needs to be realsitic. Otherwise the steps you take to reach your dream may never be attained and the journey is a failure. So, before you do set out on the journey set attainable goals, and your limits will be unbreakable.
    Maki Fit Blog

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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  7. #32
    Bodybuilding Mythbuster
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    I do not always agree with what Mr. Riddington or for that matter Mr. Mason have to say. But they have hit the nail on the head here, (and better than I could have done it.) Realistic targets are the way to go. Take the goal of benching 500 lbs. Very few people will be capable of doing this (with good form). And (I believe) it is impossible without the use of steroids. Anyway Mr.Gopro, believe me, I do understand what you are trying to accomplish. I just feel it should have been stated with a caveat or two. Blanket generalizations are not really that helpful and create self-imposed limitations. If someone really feels that he should have no limits, yet his body is not capable of reproducing the lifts of his friends, he is more likely to give up and feel that he has failed. We should encourage realistic expectations is what I am saying.

  8. #33
    Ex-Mod Jane's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Belial
    People can surprise themselves. Maybe goal setting long term isn't what you need. It's like climbing a windy mountain path, surrounded by trees. All you see is the endless path in front of you, all you can think about is the next turn, the next rock to climb over, the next ditch to avoid. But the whole time, you know you're climbing higher and higher. You may not be able to tell by looking behind you... all you remember is more of the same road, perhaps closer to the ground, but more of the same anyway.

    Then, every now and then, you see a break in the trees, and you get the chance to pause and look down. Then you really see how far you've come.

    It's not about making a beeline for the top. It's not even about visualizing the top, really. It's about the journey. The next step, the next turn. You know you're leaving other travelers behind if you keep walking, so it doesn't matter how many are ahead of you. Every step you take takes you farther and farther from the crowd in the foothills. You may never stand on the summit, but regardless of how high you get, you'll have made the journey.

    That's all it's about. A year ago, I wouldn't have believed I could have deadlifted 535. I didn't think about it. I was working on pulling 405. That's all that mattered to me. If you enjoy the journey, enjoy every small challenge, and every now and then take a look down without obsessing over how far you've yet to go, you'll keep progressing.
    I'm printing this out.
    "Then on leg day do squats, lunges, stiff legged deadlifts, fluffernutters, and calf raises."--Belial, training a newbie

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  9. #34
    WBBs motivational Speaker Rock's Avatar
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    good thread!

    If the gym is closed, I just find a way to get in and train, maybe trough a fire door or something, because nothing will stop me.
    A big thanks to all my friends in the USA, I am deeply grateful for your hospitality and kindness.

  10. #35
    Have you seen my puke bag Bobo's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Jane


    I'm printing this out.
    :withstupi

    great post belial
    I'm in shape. ROUND is a shape

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  11. #36
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    Well, I'm glad the post was edited...anyway, to each his own. When I started lifting weights at 16 or so at a pathetically thin 125 lbs I was told that my genetics were very poor for bodybuilding, and that without steroids I'd be lucky to ever weigh 200 lbs.

    Back then I thought to myself, "wow, I'd love to weigh just 180 or so!" When I accomplished that I remembered what I was told...I'd be lucky to ever reach 200 naturally (and I'm talking about being in reasonable condition). Well, being only 20 lbs away I decided to go for it. When I got there I figured I must be near or at my limits now...and besides, I was 200 lbs in decent shape. People recognized me as a "bodybuilder." And I NEVER thought anyone would ever refer to me as "big guy." But now they were! Cool!

    Then I decided to enter a show. I asked some experienced competitors how they thought I'd do. They said that it was my first show and that I should just do it for the experience. I agreed. So I entered the Natural Eastern USA. I was intimidated...scared as hell. My best friend was backstage with me helping me pump up. I was looking around at the other guys...to me they looked huge and ripped. I was hoping not to finish last. I started to pump up, but wouldn't take my clothes off until the last minute. When the backstage expeditor said, "time to line up," I reluctantly took off my clothes. My friend said," HOLY ****...you look sick!" Then a guy in the in the heavyweights...I was middleweight...came up to me and said, "see ya in the posedown."

    That was the point where my mindset changed...I was beginning to believe. Instead of just showing up at this show I realized I can win this show. With every pose I became more confident. They kept moving me until I was in the middle of the stage. They were comparing everyone to ME. I won the whole damn thing.

    After this show I forgot about limits. Didn't think about em. When I got to 220 I wanted 230...when I got there I wanted 240. I'm a little over 260 now and I want 270. My goal was once to simply be bigger, then to do a show...now, I'm on the brink of turning WNBF pro against many that cheat the rules...I know they do but I don't care. Never in my life did I think I'd bench 500 and I did that too!

    I am not saying that I can "think" my way to looking like Ronnie Coleman without using drugs...what I am saying is that I don't think about myself having limits and what I could never do...and it is this thinking that will let me reach to places that others don't think it is possible to get to.

    Agree, disagree, it doesn't matter to me. You can think however you wish.
    Last edited by gopro; 10-13-2002 at 03:30 PM.

  12. #37
    Bodybuilding Mythbuster
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    Originally posted by gopro

    Never in my life did I think I'd bench 500 and I did that too!

    I .
    There are only a handful of elite powerlifters who can do that. You are a bodybuilder and can do that too? There are bodybuilders who have very good genetics and take steroids (which you claim you do not) and yet cannot bench 500 lbs. Yet you (without the aid of steroids) have? Okay, this is getting silly. I'm done. tuttut

  13. #38
    Jack's Utter Surprise Saturday Fever's Avatar
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    You are being very naive in your thinking that only steroid freaks can bench 500. I would be hard-pressed to agree, as well however, that someone lifting like a bodybuilder is doing 500 on bench.

  14. #39
    hmm, I like to be big!!!
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    Well, I think it would be VERY impressive to bench 500 lbs raw and without roids, i mean, jesus, yuo're close to Kennellyhood i'd think. You'd have to not only dedicate your life to lifting, but I'd think you'd have to specialize in benching too. So you're not even being impressive, you're just getting tunnelvision. Plus, a lot of poeple lose a lot of athletic ability as they get stronger. Personally, I'd rather be able to run about 3 miles, move quickly and flexibly, and bench, squats and deadlift good amounts. like 350/450/500 then merely be able to bench 500.
    Chris Mason is my master.....

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    Belial in reference to Ronnie Coleman, "Some people say he still has blood in his steroid stream, but I doubt it. Gas isn't one of the side effects, but that massive bloated overly muscular freak of nature circus sideshow appearance might be what tips most people off."

  15. #40
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Glad my post made sense to some people.
    "Except Belial. He knows everything. This isn't a sarcastic attack, either. He really knows everything." -----Organichu
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  16. #41
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    Originally posted by ExtremeAnabolic


    There are only a handful of elite powerlifters who can do that. You are a bodybuilder and can do that too? There are bodybuilders who have very good genetics and take steroids (which you claim you do not) and yet cannot bench 500 lbs. Yet you (without the aid of steroids) have? Okay, this is getting silly. I'm done. tuttut
    Well, I happen to know a few guys that can bench well over 500 lbs. Actually there is this 20 something year old kid in my gym that does not use roids and is big, but not huge, and he benched 525 the other day...AND THIS WAS AFTER WORKING UP TO THIS WEIGHT RATHER SLOWLY. Yes, he is extremely genetically gifted when it comes to strength, especially in pressing movements, but still, people like this are all over the place.

    Now my road to 500 was different considering that at my first workout I had trouble with 85 lbs. My idols in bodybuilding as I started out were guys that trained HEAVY...Casey Viator, Bertil Fox, franco Columbo, etc. So although my MAIN goal was to be a bodybuilder I still wanted to be just as strong as I looked. I based most of my training around the compound lifts, which is really what gave me the necessary size anyway.

    Personally I don't think my 500 bench (I should mention that I no longer bench press) was all that impressive as I have known guys that weighed less than me that lifted better percentages of their bodyweight. Gosh, if you don't believe that I benched 500 I won't even mention some of my better lifts.

    Anyway, thats the story.

  17. #42
    Energizer Bunnie
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    Originally posted by gopro
    I will NEVER set limits on what I can accomplish...I hope most of you don't either!
    Fantastic post Gopro . The mind is an amazing tool...I have noticed a marked difference in my own results since I have been more focused, relentless & visualised my workout prior to going to the gym. When I have a "bad day" its usually because I have not mentally prepared myself .

    Belial, that post of your's is sensational.... I agree with Jane...its so worthy of a printout.
    "Happiness is not an accident. Nor is it something you wish for. Happiness is something you design." Jim Rohn

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  18. #43
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    Originally posted by Franjipani


    Fantastic post Gopro . The mind is an amazing tool...I have noticed a marked difference in my own results since I have been more focused, relentless & visualised my workout prior to going to the gym. When I have a "bad day" its usually because I have not mentally prepared myself .

    Belial, that post of your's is sensational.... I agree with Jane...its so worthy of a printout.
    AWESOME MY FRIEND! I'm glad you liked my post!

  19. #44
    Fighting Genetics AdamGberg's Avatar
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    honestly sometimes i see all the guys that are all cut up and big and it is discouraging to me more then helpful. but a will to be HEALTHY and HAPPY with my own self image has helped me continue to workout. it takes determination and a will to lift. i like the list.
    good job gopro!
    "Don't take life too serious, you'll never get out alive."-Van Wilder

  20. #45
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    Originally posted by AdamGberg
    honestly sometimes i see all the guys that are all cut up and big and it is discouraging to me more then helpful. but a will to be HEALTHY and HAPPY with my own self image has helped me continue to workout. it takes determination and a will to lift. i like the list.
    good job gopro!
    Your comments are appreciated. Thank you.

  21. #46
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Saturday Fever
    You are being very naive in your thinking that only steroid freaks can bench 500. I would be hard-pressed to agree, as well however, that someone lifting like a bodybuilder is doing 500 on bench.

    He is not being naive. He is mentioning a raw bench press, as GoPro claims. There are very few people, very few, who can bench press 500lbs raw. There are fewer still who are natural and can bench press 500lbs raw. We need only to look to the past, pre-steroids, to see that even huge Olympic gold medalists such as Doug Hepburn and Paul Anderson could only bench press in the 500s. Both men spent their lives concentrating on building strength. Doug pushed 530 lbs strict, and possibly 580lbs loose. Paul is reported to have benched 575 lbs. Both men performed the lift raw. I am sorry to say, but nobody will ever convince me that GoPro is even close to being on the same strength level as either of those 2 men (if he is natural). Both of those men were known for amazing pressing power in the overhead press. Doug concentrated on the bench press for a period of time.


    Here is a blurb on Doug if you are interested:
    http://www.bdfpa.plus.com/DOUG.htm

    Please note that the claimed bench by Paul Anderson in that article is not a sanctioned lift, only a claimed one. My numbers from above are from Jeff Everson.


    A few pics of Paul:
    http://www.payh.org/slides/slide_pages/1.htm
    http://www.payh.org/slides/slide_pages/2.htm
    http://www.payh.org/slides/slide_pages/7.htm
    Last edited by chris mason; 10-15-2002 at 08:37 AM.

  22. #47
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    Chris...I am NOT looking to get started in a bad way with you again, but I have benched 500 at a bodyweight of about 250 or so. My bodyfat was kinda high at the time and I was VERY strong in all lifts. Like I said, there is a 22 or 23, not sure year old kid in my gym that is natural that benched 525 in front of several witnesses recently. He weighs about 225 and is just a natural powerhouse. It is far from inconceivable that I benched 500 lbs.

  23. #48
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Go read the article I just referenced on Doug. Then tell me what you have done naturally.

    You are not even close to being one of the strongest natural men of all time. Period. You really need to reconsider your claims.

  24. #49
    Journalist galileo's Avatar
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    Originally posted by chris mason
    Go read the article I just referenced on Doug. Then tell me what you have done naturally.

    You are not even close to being one of the strongest natural men of all time. Period. You really need to reconsider your claims.
    There must be something in the waterglutes over there. He benches 500, some kidgearhead benches 525, all naturalexceptsteroids, rawifyoudontcountthebenchshirt, and elegantwithonlyatinyspot ! You should bottle whatever yer drinkinginjecting mister, because you'd make a killing.

  25. #50
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    Originally posted by chris mason
    Go read the article I just referenced on Doug. Then tell me what you have done naturally.

    You are not even close to being one of the strongest natural men of all time. Period. You really need to reconsider your claims.
    I know I'm not as strong as Doug...never said I was. I don't even compare myself to him...you compared me. I'm not really understanding why you are having such a hard time believing me about 500 lbs. My training partner is a middleweight natural competitor. He weighs maybe 180 right now and is under 10% BF. He is currently squatting around 475 strict and slow...deadlifting about 525...and benching around 355-360. Pound for pound he is probably stronger than me in many lifts. I'm really gonna keep my mouth shut as far as some as my other lifts...thats for sure!

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