The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #51
    Wannabebig Member
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    From 'The doctors medical library' -

    HERE


    "The liver breaks excess protein down into urea which is excreted through the kidneys. In circumstances of excessive protein intake, excessive quantities of urea pass through the kidneys. Urea is a diuretic, which means that water is made to exit along with urea, and this water loss means the simultaneous loss of minerals. The most important mineral lost is calcium."

  2. #52
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
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    You don't excrete protein, urea is a byproduct of protein digestion and only occurs when the protein is absorbed and thus used (for something). Solution to water loss - drink water. Solution to mineral and vitamin loss - take a multivitamin/mineral supps.

  3. #53
    Anavar eating mofo
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    It was justa joke BlackAlpha. I respect the fact that you do what you do and you get results from it. Speaking of that, I dont think it matters how you eat, sleep, train, or whatever just as long as you look in the mirror and are happy with your progress.

  4. #54
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    Cack: if the body does not excrete excess protein where does it go?

  5. #55
    Player Hater PowerManDL's Avatar
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    Ok, lets examine this from a practical standpoint.

    For example, you need 3000 calories a day. Out of two meals, that's 1500 calories each.

    Just the simple fact that its damn hard to eat 1500 calories at once makes this mode impractical.

    Secondly, the things you'd have to eat to get 1500 calories at one sitting aren't going to be the most healthy.

    Thirdly, that insulin response you're so afraid of is going to kick in like a mofo. The body's going to take what it needs from that meal, and store all the leftovers. Which is going to be a lot.

    If you think that eating a big meal is going to slow down digestion long enough to make it last, uh-uh. That meal may take an hour, two at the most to digest. By then, all the bad metabolic stuff will have kicked in, and your basically screwed.

    Regardless of the thermic effect of digestion and the precious hGH/insulin antagonism, you aren't doing yourself a favor by eating that way.
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  6. #56
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
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    It goes to tissue repair, burned for energy, or stored as glycogen, Ronan.

    "For example, you need 3000 calories a day. Out of two meals, that's 1500 calories each.

    Just the simple fact that its damn hard to eat 1500 calories at once makes this mode impractical.

    Secondly, the things you'd have to eat to get 1500 calories at one sitting aren't going to be the most healthy."

    Agreed. Some people actually find this easier, though...so they would be better off with this approach.

    "Thirdly, that insulin response you're so afraid of is going to kick in like a mofo. The body's going to take what it needs from that meal, and store all the leftovers. Which is going to be a lot."

    Yes, but at the end of the day the result will be the same.

    "If you think that eating a big meal is going to slow down digestion long enough to make it last, uh-uh. That meal may take an hour, two at the most to digest. By then, all the bad metabolic stuff will have kicked in, and your basically screwed."

    Bollox.

    "Regardless of the thermic effect of digestion and the precious hGH/insulin antagonism, you aren't doing yourself a favor by eating that way."

    That depends.

  7. #57
    Player Hater PowerManDL's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cack-ass
    "Thirdly, that insulin response you're so afraid of is going to kick in like a mofo. The body's going to take what it needs from that meal, and store all the leftovers. Which is going to be a lot."

    Yes, but at the end of the day the result will be the same.


    Not if 85% of those calories were stored as fat, whereas if you had eaten them across several meals, you'd have left your insulin levels stable and kept the nutrients where they were needed.


    "If you think that eating a big meal is going to slow down digestion long enough to make it last, uh-uh. That meal may take an hour, two at the most to digest. By then, all the bad metabolic stuff will have kicked in, and your basically screwed."

    Bollox.


    BS. You go eat two meals with 1500 calories each and tell me you don't get fat. I don't mean big, I mean *fat.* This is about that nutrient partitioning effect you've mentioned before. If you eat them all at once, the slower digestion isn't enough to offset the fact that, at the moment, you've consumed more calories than you need. They will be stored as fat.

    If you spread them out, the body's momentary need for nutrients is being met, and the food is being "partitioned" to where its needed, i.e., bodily functions and repair, as opposed to fat stores.

    The process doesn't even out.


    "Regardless of the thermic effect of digestion and the precious hGH/insulin antagonism, you aren't doing yourself a favor by eating that way."

    That depends.


    On what? Whether you want to get fat or whether you want to get muscular?
    Vin Diesel has a fever.. and the only prescription is more cowbell.

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  8. #58
    Senior Member Wizard's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cackerot69
    "Thirdly, that insulin response you're so afraid of is going to kick in like a mofo. The body's going to take what it needs from that meal, and store all the leftovers. Which is going to be a lot."

    Yes, but at the end of the day the result will be the same.
    That's the point.At the end of the day the result will be the same.
    You may store some fat after eating a huge meal,but if it's quite low fat (~20%of calories) then the amount of stored fat is not gonna be big.All the carbs will be converted to glucose,as excessive protein will do,and then they will be stored in the glycogen stores.If glycogen stores are full then and only then,they will be stored in the adipose tissue.(fat)And you know that this happens even if you eat 5-8 meals per day.
    But let's say that you stored some fat.This stored fat,and even more stored fat is going to burned by your body until it gets the other meal the next day.(assuming that you have one meal per day.)
    Between these meals you can have a small amount of omega3's so that you enhance lipolysis but not a high amount to cause high blood lipid levels which restrict the amount of circulating GH in blood.

  9. #59
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    protein abosrption. problems with protein absorption are 1) the physical or chemical structure are resitant to proteolytic attack and therefore pass through the intestine small intestine relatively unchanged. this will not make a difference between one meal a day or 10, but shows why protein abosrption is not 100%. 2) free amino aciods and peptides may not absorbed particulary if gut functions are imparied. this will make a difference between larger and small meals as with smaller meals the gut can still handle the amount of food, where as larger meals the volume will be to much for a impared gut to handle. 3) antinutritonal factor such as lectins and trypsins present in foods that if eating larger meals you are more likley to contain as they are there with fibre so aless you wnat constipation its better to eat small meals in which foods these are not present in.
    metabolism by the colonic micorflora then occurs but amino acids are no longer available by this stage.

    so to minimise the effects of points two and three smaller meals are better. can any one here tell me there gut is working 100% effeciently.

    cack wrote"OMG enough with this "excess protein is converted to fat" bullshit! Excess protein is converted to carbs via gluconeogensis! Only when you overeat carbs AND protein AND have a caliorie surplus AND meet repair requirements does protein get stored as fat. And as I stated above your "starvation mode" thing is incorrect. "

    once the protien has done its job for anabolism and excess cals are consumed wether protien,fat, carbs or alcohol or any other calorific compound, then yes protien will be converteed to fat. though it does go by glucogensis, you can fill up your glycogen stores by this way. then the excess will be converted to fat from the excess glycogen. you can do this if you eat enough protien by its self. Its not the most effeicent method but it can and will happen if to much protien is consumed.

    cack wrote "What do you mean it doesn't know when it's next meal is? If you always eat at the same time then it will "know" when it's next meal would be. Insulin may be anabolic, but it also increases fat storage more than anything. The key is to know whento spike insulin, such a time is post workout. So, you would have one of your 2 meals post workout, or even just one meal for the whole day and have it post workout. "
    so what happens if you miss a meal then? it does not think like that it can not as this not suited for survival. as soon as it relaise its got no food intake it starts to prepare for famine. otheriwise it survival will be severly shortend. your brain may no you are going to eat but biochemiacally your body will not beable to sustain hormone levels to maintain anabolism, so it will do its best to survive.

    cack wrote"I don't see how more meals with the same amount and type of carb increases insulin sensitivity. Some things that do are weight training, aerobics, omerga 3's, ALA, chronium, etc...and things we often take to help fat loss like ECA and ketogenic diets can decrease insulin sensitivity, so personally, I don't think it's such a big deal. "
    well fisrt off you want to increase insulin sesenitivity therefore requiring your body to produce less insulin to get the same amount of amino acids into the cells. diabetes is a disease brought on by insulin resticance 9p[lus other ways)eg cells have lower sensivity thereofore making the body work hard to produce the same amount of insulin.
    smaller meals of the same type and total amount of carbs over the day will not ask to produce so much insulin in one go therefore stressing it less. less stress will mean its less likely to stop working thereofre decreasing your chances of diabetes and help maintian increased insulin sensitivity.

    cack wrote"If you eat enough for anabolism then you will grow, regardless of the amount of meals. The digestion time difference is huge, you will still have amino's, glucose and EFA's circulating through your blood and getting used for a long time with larger meals. "
    no one said you can not grow by eating 3 meals a day its just more optimal to eat more smaller meals. as you said above you may be eating 2 meals so that leaves at least 12 hours between meals. your body will have not be in a anabolic state for that long as it will have finished absorbing nutrients so it will act if not going to eat agian therfore initiate its survival mechanisms.
    you will have some glucose circulating in your blood if you do not eat for the next month just the maount of ketone bodies will be a lot greater.

  10. #60
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    blackalpha - when you have restored your glycogen stores, you will start to deplete them stright away. eg walking, will start to use them up, so where is the new glycogen going to come from? will glucogenisis occur? yep so therfore you are going to be loosing muscle, yes some tof this will come from fat, so if loosing weight, you will loose fat as well, but you will also loose muscle as well. this will go to you next eat. if thats 20 hours away in your case that a long time to be loosing muscle. for for aless sleeping it will be about 0 hrs so i will start to replensih my glycogen stores as soon as the last meal has stoped providing glycogen for me.
    when you go to the gym you will not have the energy of as lower storages aless you have lost more muscle so therfore i will be growing better than if i ate one meal a day.

    here is a question for one meal a day people, lots of poeple are getting fatter? correct. But lots of children are skipping breakfast? correct. ebven though they are getting fatter as they are eating to much but they are not having breakfast thats means they are getting sufficient macronutrients? yep. but how come they have lower IQ's and not do as well at school? because they insulin levels drop to low so they have to little blood sugar therfore in a catabolic mode as they have not eaten enough. the lower insulin levels does not allow them to concentrate properly so do poorer at school. blackaphla and cack can you explain this to me, as they eat to much as getting fatter, but they insulin levels have droped to low to provide adequate energy. this will cause catabolism as amino acids will go through glucogenisis

  11. #61
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    damn body those are some damn good points

  12. #62
    Senior Member Wizard's Avatar
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    Sure,very good point.
    when you go to the gym you will not have the energy of as lower storages aless you have lost more muscle so therfore i will be growing better than if i ate one meal a day
    Having very low blood sugar levels makes you feel lethargic and of course you don't have adequate energy levels but it has not do to with more frequent meals but with macros in meals.If the meal you ate was primaly fat and a little protein,you'll feel the same crap.

    But lots of children are skipping breakfast? correct. even though they are getting fatter as they are eating to much but they are not having breakfast thats means they are getting sufficient macronutrients? yep. but how come they have lower IQ's and not do as well at school? because they insulin levels drop to low so they have to little blood sugar therfore in a catabolic mode as they have not eaten enough. the lower insulin levels does not allow them to concentrate properly so do poorer at school
    That's right because they don't fuel their brain with glucose and their performances suck.If you want to combine the poor performance at school with the poor performance at gym due to lack of concentration ,I get your point and you're right again.Though I kept allmost the same lifts,I feel less concentrated at gym.Some people's lifts will suffer as individual's reactions to diet changes vary.

  13. #63
    Senior Member Yaz's Avatar
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    How is eating 100g of carbs per sitting and having say 40 of them stored as triglycerides more efficient than eating 50g of carbs in two sittings, depleting 40g worth from moderate activity in 2.5 hours, eating another 50 and having, say, perhaps... 10g more than you should have in the form of triglycerides?

    10 < 40. What happens if you eat that meal, and all the sudden you break your leg? Now you can't depend on your activity to burn off the fat storage. It's just better overall management of calories and energy. I agree to the point that a person can maintain their weight by eating a huge meal a day, but in no way can you efficiently build muscle like this, nor can you balance hormonal levels in the body with it. Leveled off blood sugar levels can aid in the process of lipolysis, directly by regulating insulin in the body, and indirectly by killing off cravings before they start.

    It's just a win-win situation to eat more frequently.

  14. #64
    Senior Member Yaz's Avatar
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    Also why is PowerMan's statement about high insulin levels after a meal jam-packed with calories bollox? As I understand, 50g of dextrose causes more of a spike than 20.

    So of course 300g of carbs in one meal is going to cause a heavier spike than 50g of carbs in 6. I know you know what happens when you spike the insulin, Cack. This is related to energy levels too, aside the fat storage. Spikes will give you energy for a little bit of time, but they come down and also induce sleepiness. So yes, your performance will suck in comparison.
    Last edited by Yaz; 08-18-2001 at 05:35 PM.

  15. #65
    Party of "No." Tryska's Avatar
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    not to mention running the risk of developing insulin resistance.

    you send that large amoung of carbs into the stomach, and get blood glucose levels from hell, and insulin rushes out to flood the receptors right? so what happens when the recptors just stop firing as nicely, and you need to flood more and more insulin into the bloodstream to set them off?


    eating that one meal before bed is a recipe for disaster...remember, insulin - glucagon....insulin stores fat, glucagon sets it free. you eat all your carbs at once, you set an insulin spike....right about when you go to sleep. and you metabolism slows to a crawl.....and that insulin stores all that glucose that doesn't go to glycogen (which is finite) as fat.
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  16. #66
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cackerot69
    [B]"Just to back myself up on more meals not increasing metabolism....

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...om_uid=9155494


    *** Abstracts = little to be told about the actually study.
    Find some studies and post them so they can be looked at.
    I skimmed through 5 or 6 of the abstracts and they really don't say much.
    You read into things too much.
    Last edited by Maki Riddington; 08-18-2001 at 05:57 PM.
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  17. #67
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
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    I feel great with little to no blood glucose, so no problem there.

    The confusion seems to be how much food the body can utilize without fat spill-over, and there is an amount. But, while this fat storage will take place, the newly stored fat will just be used as energy later in the day because your food intake isn't above maintenance.

    Maki, look them up yourself...or what that be reading into things too much?

  18. #68
    Tuna Freak Frankster's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cackerot69
    But, while this fat storage will take place, the newly stored fat will just be used as energy later in the day because your food intake isn't above maintenance.

    I don't agree .. why would the body not use muscle as an energy source?... that would be the efficient thing for the body to do since its not gonna get any calories for a long while... it would decrease its metabolism.
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  19. #69
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
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    Muscle is only used as energy to a significant extent during activity while carb depleted....you won't be carb depleted in 6-8 hours, but liver glyocogen likely will be, so cardio ain't a good idea.

  20. #70
    Senior Member w8lifter's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cackerot69

    OMG enough with this "excess protein is converted to fat" bullshit!
    Does anyone else find it hilairious that Cack said OMG? LMAO

  21. #71
    Tuna Freak Frankster's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cackerot69
    Muscle is only used as energy to a significant extent during activity while carb depleted....you won't be carb depleted in 6-8 hours, but liver glyocogen likely will be, so cardio ain't a good idea.
    Why won't you be carb depleted?

    you just said:

    ''But, while this fat storage will take place, the newly stored fat will just be used as energy later in the day because your food intake isn't above maintenance. ''
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  22. #72
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
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    ??

    Because carb depletion takes longer than that.

  23. #73
    Anavar eating mofo
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    If protein is stored as glucose when repair is no longer an issue in your body, then why do people on keto diets walk around glycogen depleted?

  24. #74
    Senior Member Cackerot69's Avatar
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    Because the high fat intake forces the body to use fat for fuel, which prevents protein -- carb conversion and makes dietary and bodyfat the main source for fuel.

  25. #75
    Player Hater PowerManDL's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Frankster


    Why won't you be carb depleted?

    you just said:

    ''But, while this fat storage will take place, the newly stored fat will just be used as energy later in the day because your food intake isn't above maintenance. ''
    You're right, Frankster-- Cack-ass's logic is flawed in this case. I don't care how much you ate in that big meal, the excess carbs are largely going to fat. And the next time your blood sugar drops below a certain level, which will happen in a few hours, that glucose is coming from muscle.
    Vin Diesel has a fever.. and the only prescription is more cowbell.

    Budiak: That girl I maced
    Budiak: macked
    Budiak: heh maced
    Budiak: I wish

    ShmrckPmp5: a good thing people can't fire guns through the computer...your ass would have been shot years ago

    Y2A 47: youre smooth as hell
    Y2A 47: thats why you get outta tickets, and into panties

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