The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #26
    Gym ratt/Part-time pimp LAM's Avatar
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    Originally posted by ElPietro
    Just to clarify, I'm not saying he'll dominate, or even necessarily win, but to speak in absolutes, such as saying no chance really is a poor assessment.

    If any of these guys could go toe to toe with a world class boxer, I'm pretty sure they woulda gone that route, rather than settle for the chump change of mma.
    if he were to go against a top level MMA in K-1 he will not do good at all.

    there is a huge difference between MMA and boxing.

  2. #27
    Banned Berserker's Avatar
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    Tyson still has alot of size and brute force going for him. He looks more like an ape

  3. #28
    Son of Krypton Majestic's Avatar
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    I don't know much about K1, or whatever, by my assessments are as follows:

    1) Tyson is the scariest heavyweight EVER.

    2) nobody ever beat Tyson in his prime, when he was coached/managed by his original staff (pre-Don King.....i.e.....pre head-hunter era)

    3) Lennox Lewis is not a Heavyweight. He's a SuperWeight. And therein lies the problem......there's NO such thing. A man who is 6'4" with a trillion inch reach should not be fighting a human muscle stump like Tyson at 5'10" or 5'11".

    The fact that Tyson has destroyed people larger than himself his whole career speaks to his FORMERLY ridiculous speed, and FORMERLY semi-scientific approach to boxing.

    Lennox Lewis is the SAME age as Tyson. Where was Lennox Lewis at age 20? Was he the heavyweight champ? No.

    Where was Lennox Lewis at age 23??

    Where was Lennox Lewis at age 25??

    Where was Lennox Lewis at age 28??

    Where was Lennox Lewis at age 30??

    He couldn't beat Tyson until they were both...what......34???

    Tyson's game was based on a "twitchy" yet thunderous punch....he had more to lose than Lennox ever did.

    This is why a guy like Shaq could be potentially an identical athlete from age 21 until age 35, yet Jordan was done attacking the basket after age 30. The shorter, quicker guys always have more to lose.

    Same goes for Holyfield. Yeah yeah, his stamina, tactics, and all-around game made him very impressive, but get real. Holyfield fights Tyson in 1987, and he gets stomped.

    But ultimately, I really don't care if he's the "best", or top-5 ever, or "washed-up", or "only had a top-20 career".


    The guy is a freak. The guy is an entertainer. Entertainment is his job.

    If they so much as broadcast Mike Tyson eating a pizza, I'll be watching.
    Last edited by Majestic; 08-28-2003 at 08:05 PM.

  4. #29
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    majestic i agree, but were talking about NOW, not 1991 when he was in his prime.

    NOW he sucks, he cant fight for crap. even if sapp sucks, tyson sucks probably even more.

    tyson built a helluva name for himself over a decade ago, but its time to let go people, he's done.
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  5. #30
    Too Beaucoup -sin-'s Avatar
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    Tyson could be a monster if he did some cross-training and picked up some ground skills. His style of boxing is perfect for MMA.. look how successful Vitor Belfort was. Sure he is also a great BJJ practitioner but most of his fights were little more than a slugfest.

    I think he can beat Sapp in K-1 rules since it will basically just be a dirty boxing match. But a guy like Cro Cop would kick Tyson's head off.

  6. #31
    Senior Member Bruteman's Avatar
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    Tyson only looks bad against top 10 type heavyweights. When they put him in with everyone else he still destroys them. People seem to not realize he is just not what he used to be, but he is still one of the best out there. I'm with -sin- that since it's K-1 rules Tyson will be able to do well. Now other MMA stuff might be a little tougher, but with that punch he still has a chance.
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  7. #32
    Baby Seal Clubber ElPietro's Avatar
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    Majestic, Tyson ducked fights with Lennox for most of his early career. So that's why they didn't fight. Then Lennox allowed him to have a shot at the title, probably just to shut the critics up.

    They had known each other for quite some time, and I think Don and Mike both knew that Lennox was the only guy out there that could beat him.

    It's funny, one of my best buds, has a friend that was Lennox' girlfriend when he was living in kitchener out here, and she has heard conversations with Lennox being offered money by Don King to not try and force a fight.

    He's always been a good boxer, you just probably don't get anywhere near the media coverage from a Jamaican/Canadian/British guy as you do an american in the states.
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  8. #33
    Almost Famous johnny123's Avatar
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    in MMA he has slim to no chance against anyone good. In K1? he could out punch some of them, and has a hard head. I think he could beat Bob Sapp, anyway.
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  9. #34
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    Tyson sure isn't what he used to be. Back in the days, the guy was a machine and built an image of unmatched aggressivity and superhuman power for himself. That's exactly what people want to have today, a superhero gone nuts. We don't have that anymore. Lennox is a great fighter but nobody talks of him as something else than a great fighter. It is sad but I don't think Tyson can live up to what he used to be, but people are still willing to pay ... even just to see him eat a pizza... so he fights. On the other hand Bam Bam...
    Last edited by Sinep; 08-29-2003 at 11:48 AM.
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  10. #35
    Senior Member howsertrading's Avatar
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    "Where was Lennox Lewis at age 23??"
    I believe he was busy knocking out Riddick Bowe to win the olympic gold medal that year
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  11. #36
    Son of Krypton Majestic's Avatar
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    Originally posted by ElPietro
    He's always been a good boxer, you just probably don't get anywhere near the media coverage from a Jamaican/Canadian/British guy as you do an american in the states.
    He's a great boxer, especially for someone of his lanky and towering height.

    The fact remains, the title isn't "Biggest Boxer in The World".

    It's Heavyweight Champion. And Lennox Lewis is no heavyweight. Period. They don't have a class for Lennox.

    It doesn't make him a "once-in-a-lifetime boxer".

    Lennox has gotten his ass handed to him a few times, mainly by people who aren't "better" than Tyson, but are more physically suited.

    Roy Jones Jr. is a better boxer than Lennox, but he certainly wouldn't stand a chance against him.

    At some point you have to nod to power & destruction.....believe me....I'm not one of those Bantam Weight lovers, or whatever.

    Still, Lennox is inferior compared to a 20 year old Tyson. I'm talking 1986, Megatron.

    You talk about Don King paying Lennox to avoid Tyson.....Don King didn't manage (and have his coaches teach) Tyson until 2 or 3 fights before Buster Douglas. Tyson was history (mentally) by then.

    Tysons' speed has eroded, but not "minimized"......he's still in better condition than 99% of human beings.

    Tyson even admits.....the guys is waaaay bigger than him.

    You wouldn't ask a considerably more skilled player like Iverson to play one-on-one with Mehmet Okur (you probably don't even know who that is...he's a 7 footer for the Pistons).

    Iverson is gonna lose. Period. End of story.

    Anyway, I don't how far Tyson would go in either of these Tournaments, especially one involving expert grapplers, but I know this: those guys are your basic "good" athletes who have an outstanding KNOWLEDGE and MASTERY of grappling.

    Tyson is a freak, he's like Barry Sanders: neither one has a mid-section. It's like their chest attaches to their waste. They have a freakish "athlete's core".

    The simple fact that Tyson has an alien/Martian/otherworldy twitch in his punch is the very reason he can....at the blink of an eye.....defy the very "rules" of any sport, and knock someone out.

    That doesn't mean he's gonna win, or even get past the first round. It certainly means that he's a "darkhorse" threat, though.

    And he'll be very entertaining either way.

  12. #37
    Son of Krypton Majestic's Avatar
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    Originally posted by howsertrading


    I believe he was busy knocking out Riddick Bowe to win the olympic gold medal that year
    Not impressive.

    Michigan's Chris Byrd won the Gold Medal back in 1992, has an outstanding fight record, is the #1 contender in one of the heavyweight divisions, yet can't get anyone to fight him because he refuses to sign with Don King.

    Chris hasn't fought the top fighters, and neither has Lennox. A post-1988 Tyson doesn't count. Sorry. Lennox is 6'4" b*tch.

  13. #38
    Senior Member Bruteman's Avatar
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    Majestic: just cause Tyson got to the top faster doesn't make him better. An example of what I mean: Lee Priest came on to the bodybuilding scene with a blast at a young age, now he is just one of the guys. Ron Coleman took forever to get to the top, but his pinnicale is a hell of a lot higher than Lee's. Do you see what I mean? Lenox just took longer to come into his own. Now I'm not saying you have to like him(I don't really), but do give him his props for his skills in the ring(when he actually shows up ready for a fight ).

    One more thing, Chris wasn't winning the Heavyweight gold(he was lighter then, I think super-middle, not sure though), so Lennox beating Bowe is a little more impressive than Chris's win and people don't like to fight him cause he's a slick fighter that makes you look bad even if you manage to beat him. Although, not signing with Don is a problem too. D@mn that Don King, I wish Tyson would flip out and KO that piece of crap.
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  14. #39
    Son of Krypton Majestic's Avatar
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    ?????

    Mike Tyson hasn't been managed by Don King for quite a while.

    Since he's been over the hill, in fact.

    Ali wasn't any (or at least truly) damn good after the age of 28, and neither was Tyson.

    I say again, Lennox Lewis is not impressive. He's merely a decent boxer in a tall man's body, with a tall man's reach. That's it. Being tall, lanky, and talentless, he had nothing to lose.

    He's been the same good (yet unimpressive) athlete since he was 21.

  15. #40
    Son of Krypton Majestic's Avatar
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    ........lotsa people talking here who weren't even eating solid foods in 1985-1989 (Tysons' prime)............
    Last edited by Majestic; 08-29-2003 at 08:24 PM.

  16. #41
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    lennox isnt impressive, but he still beat your hero mike tyson, and once again, this isnt 1987, this is 2003, and today, Tyson sucks.
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  17. #42
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    Also don't forget that a major tactic many of Tyson's opponents used against him was holding. Holding is forbidden in K1 giving a fighter like Tyson who relies on pure punching ability rather than any sort of tactics an advantage he never had in boxing.

    People wonder why I call myself Mr. T. One dude asked, 'does the T stand for tough?' I said no. Another dude asked if the T stands for my last name, Tureaud. No it does not. The 'T' in Mr. T stands for tuna. T loves tuna.

  18. #43
    Personal Jesus EdgeCrusher's Avatar
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    What is K1. Anything like UFC? If so, It'd be funny. If not, he should join the UFC.

  19. #44
    Senior Member Bruteman's Avatar
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    K-1 is sort of like Americanized Muay Thai.
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  20. #45
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    We shouldn't count Tyson out before he even steps in the ring in K-1. True, he's a thug and he's lost a lot of his boxing skill and his defensive ability which he hasn't had in a decade. But he still has a lot of punching power and a good amount of speed. We should remember when we've seen him fight recently was against world class boxers (I'm talking about the matches with guys like Lennox, not those pugs who were payed to take a dive). There are some great fighters in K-1 so it will be interesting to see him fight there. Like someone said, I think a good kicker will try to take out his legs since he's not used to that. I'm sure those of us here who have been kicked repeatedly in the legs Thai style remember when we first started how hard it was to even walk on that leg after a couple rounds, let alone throw effective kicks and punches.

    But Bob Sapp is not a good kicker. He's a big strong dude but his skills are still lacking. He will have his hands full. He's not going to evade Tyson's punches easily and all it will take is one solid punch from Tyson and it's over. Anyone who watched the last K-1 saw how quickly Sapp became tired. I think the odds are about 75/25 for Tyson against Sapp. Against other K-1 fighters I'm not sure.

    I think it's entertaining Tyson signed with K-1 but I'm disappointed he didn't sign with Pride because K-1 is great, but Pride is the best MMA to my tastes. I think Tyson would have more trouble in Pride since it is more true MMA than K-1 is. I'd love to see Tyson fight some of the great strikers there like Fedor, Igor, Cro Cop and it would be interesting to see what the grapplers did with him. So I hope he fights in Pride eventually. But whether he will do well or not is anyone's guess. Like LP, I don't think he'll dominate K-1 but I don't think he'll be dominated either. I do think he'll have more wins than losses though if he keeps his head about him (yeah, right).
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  21. #46
    Son of Krypton Majestic's Avatar
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    I'm guessing Mike is avoiding anyone with a skill set that could destroy him. He's trying to make money, and he's trying to entertain. He's in debt.

    I'm sure he purposely is staying away from MMA.


    .......regarding Tyson being my "hero"......

    Not quite. I appreciate, and am fascinated with any athlete who goes beyond being merely "faster, quicker, larger," etc.

    Barry Sanders is a genetic freak. At age 20 he was squatting 600 lbs. at Oklahoma State. He has (had) 4.3 speed. He has opposable ankles. He has a short, powerful stomach (thus making it easier to change directions).

    Dan Marino is a freak. It's not that he throws the ball harder, faster, or better than anyone else. He certainly can't run. But his release is so "odd", that it's practically unteachable, even impossible for almost every other gifted QB. Nobody else can wait until the last second, not wind up at all, and "flick" the ball 60 yards. Not even Favre or Elway, even though both can probably throw the ball a little bit farther.

    Walter Payton was an oddball, and so was Bo Jackson. It goes beyond being bigger/better/stronger/faster......they're just flat-out "weird" athletes.

    Tyson is a similar fascination for me. He's probably a terrible human, but as an athlete (the subject at hand), he's so completely odd, it's unfathomable. You can't "teach" someone to fight like Tyson.

    You take the most explosive puncher in the world, and his technique is still going to be different than Mike's, due to his oddball trunk (core) and hand speed. He sort of crouches down, and then explodes up with his whole back. Really weird stuff.

    ......and to this day, I know that had (the illegal cheater) Holyfield not cheated and illegally headbutted (while illegally holding) Tyson (causing his eye to swell up and almost close), he wouldn't have gotten p*ssed and bitten his ear. Tyson even warned Evander to knock it off. In fact, the "bite" occurred during one of Evander's illegal multiple illegal holding sesssions (illegally).

    That's not to say Holyfield (the illegal cheater) wouldn't have won. His game plan was to take his average self into the ring, maintain an average pace, and let Tyson headhunt himself breathless. He was going to nickel and dime his way to a scorecard finish.

    That's not fighting. That's dancing.

    Tyson is a fool, but he's also an entertaining freak. And whenever he fights, I'll be watching.
    Last edited by Majestic; 08-31-2003 at 02:46 PM.

  22. #47
    Lift-a-holic ThreeD's Avatar
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    Sapp may be big, but Tyson is strong! I saw Sapp fight against that Dutch K1 fighter, and he whooped Sapp's ass, only weighing 109kg compared to Sapp's 171 kg.

    Should be a interesting fight however
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  23. #48
    Baby Seal Clubber ElPietro's Avatar
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    Majestic, so I guess we need to make more weight classes to appease your little problem with guys that are tall? So I guess anyone can just pick up some boxing gloves if they are tall and lanky and just win the heavyweight title eh? Sh!t, I don't know how Tyson had a chance ever, we might as well just give all decisions in all future matches to tall lanky guys and that way the more compact guys stop competing since they have no chance obviously by your conclusions.

    Oh Don King was involved with Mike in '88, Tyson only started in '85. Oh and let me see, Tyson wasn't really fighting anyone special before that, Larry Holmes shoulda retired years before Tyson destroyed him. Michael Spinks? Please. And then you say that Lennox lost to inferior fighters, all I have to reply to that, is Buster Douglas.

    Tyson and Lewis sparred when they were amateurs, so they both knew about each other way before they reached fame.

    I guess all the tall people here should just bulk up and go box, they can make millions taking advantage of all the short boxers that have no chance. Maybe we shouldn't allow tall people to play basketball, or volleyball either eh? Why would you make up such dumb@ss excuses on behalf of Mike. He's a great boxer, so is Lewis. Neither of them boxed together when at similar ages, so your comparisons really mean nothing, as you really don't know, as neither do I. Just like comparing boxers out of different weight classes, you can't really do it.

    Calling a guy lanky and talentless underlines that you aren't really speaking from any knowledge or coherent thought anyway...especially when the guy is the champ of the world.
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  24. #49
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    Man Bob Sapp is a big lad but that 6 foot 7 290 pound guy Tyson put on his ass in a fight at the MGM lobby was big too... Bob Sapp will be on his face before you know what happened..

    My bro got put on his ass by Tyson a few years back in Manchester when they were sparring... Tyson aint no joke(My bro is 7 foot 320 pounds and been doing muay thai for about 18 years now)

  25. #50
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    I agree with majestic... Mike Tyson and Lennox Lewis box in opposite ways... Mike Tyson is short with a short reach but he overpowers his opponents.. Lennox Lewis is tall and has a long reach which allows him to throw punches from a distance and he likes to make his opponent tired...

    Lennox is a tall piece of crap... the man has no core... damn look at his back he looks like hes going to fall over and die any time on the other hand Tyson has a huge back and massive waist which he uses to throw huge and explosively powerful punches... the man is way above what normal athletes could reach.

    Look at Bruce Lee... 160 pounds(a lot of his life) and the man was almost ALL muscle... on top of all that he had absolutely EXPLOSIVE speed and could do things most martial artists cant dream about.. if that can be taught to a person then why arent we all pro boxers or martial artists...

    Its simple.. Tyson has a talent nobody can take away apart from a thing called OLD AGE... Tyson is crap now because of one thing and that is because he doesnt throw COMBOS any more... Tysons combos were incredible and if they get him throwing those again hes right back in the game... If tyson has the will power to learn a little kicking and start throwing more bodyshots then guess whoose back

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