The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    MilliVanilli
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    Your Opinions on HST?

    Okay, so I've tried traditional 3/4/5 day splits and haven't ever really been able to break a plateau or put on much size.


    HST doesn't seem like its exactly the best program to increase strength, but people promise to increase size. What are your opinions about this program. I have mixed emotions about doing a full body workout, but I really have a desire to put on size that just doesnt seem to be happening any other way.

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  3. #2
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    HST is a good program. I like it. However, if you're not getting any success with traditional approaches, that may mean your diet is not good. If that is the case, HST won't do any miracles.

  4. #3
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    Damn I love the way you post the same posts I want to...

    Anyone I am also interested in peoples opinions...

  5. #4
    Newd poster SquareHead's Avatar
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    It's good for size, can get boring, and does nothing for strength.
    Last edited by SquareHead; 06-07-2004 at 04:03 PM.
    Old Journal


    " I'd give up a pinky or a toe or something I don't need those"
    -PwrMajt:

    "Remember, as long as you don't kick them in the head or use a weapon, it's only a misdemeanor." -JustinASU

    I nominate this thread for the Tim Nissen Award! -El P

  6. #5
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by SquareHead
    It's good for size, can get boring, and does nothing for strength.
    I would like the best of both worlds, as would everyone...but I would be satisfied doing a program that will put size on me. I eat, and I use Opticen, and I eat some more, and lift hard, and sleep a lot...yet never could really put on any size. I'm the definition of a hardgainer, skinny ex long distance runner that just can't seem to put on any size.

    I'm looking for the best program to put on primarly size right now along with the most strength increases I can.

  7. #6
    Banned KingJustin's Avatar
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    If you're not gaining weight then it's not the lifting program's fault, it's your diet's.

    HST has some nice ideas and it's pretty good for everyone, but the reason it was created was because Bryan Haycock was having trouble getting bigger without getting stronger and he was having a very hard time getting stronger. Thus he made the program. If you're a beginner/intermediate then I think you could do a little better with a different program, personally.

  8. #7
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    So the consensus is that HST is nothing special?

  9. #8
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bizatch
    If you're not gaining weight then it's not the lifting program's fault, it's your diet's.

    HST has some nice ideas and it's pretty good for everyone, but the reason it was created was because Bryan Haycock was having trouble getting bigger without getting stronger and he was having a very hard time getting stronger. Thus he made the program. If you're a beginner/intermediate then I think you could do a little better with a different program, personally.

    No, I can gain 'weight' as in fat, but the muscle mass just isn't coming.

  10. #9
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    I've never tried HST, but have you taken a look at a Super Squats type routine? I highly recommend reading anything by Strossen or McCallum.

  11. #10
    I wannabebig!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianack4life
    No, I can gain 'weight' as in fat, but the muscle mass just isn't coming.
    then you arent training correctly =\ or eating correctly.
    Last edited by ryuage; 06-07-2004 at 05:30 PM.

  12. #11
    Banned Jezmason's Avatar
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    What exactly is HST?

  13. #12
    Senior Member geoffgarcia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianack4life
    No, I can gain 'weight' as in fat, but the muscle mass just isn't coming.
    how long have you been lifting and what type of weight changes have you seen?
    how much fat are you taking in? are you doing legs? are you doing any type of cardio?

  14. #13
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryuage
    then you arent training correctly =\ or eating correctly.

    Possibly the training thing, but I'm telling you outright...I eat a lot and I eat a clean diet.

  15. #14
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by geoffgarcia
    how long have you been lifting and what type of weight changes have you seen?
    how much fat are you taking in? are you doing legs? are you doing any type of cardio?

    I'm doing legs. I've been lifting on and off for a few years, seriously for 6 months or so. I'm no longer doing any cardio because I'm already so damn skinny and scrawny. My diet is lean, mostly consisting of milk/diary products, turkey, tuna, opticen, peanut butter, whole wheat bread, etc., etc.


    Uh my bench is still weak, but its been going up. Its still not where it should be.

    I'm about 140lbs and my max bench is about 175lbs. Goal is to eventually be doing sets of that, and to put on some size. My arms are like 13 1/4in, my chest is 33in. or so, and I'm not sure what my legs are. I have a small frame and am a small guy.

    The guy harrison that posted, is bigger than me now and surpassed all my results in just a few weeks.

  16. #15
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    I don't think I am bigger than you, but I do seem to be making gains faster than you are...

    I am still interested in HST. Some of you just make it sound like it does absolutley nothing. Would I be better off just sticking with my current full-body routine?

  17. #16
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    Might as well give HST a try...

    If you are already doing a full body routine, I don't think it will make a tremendous difference.

    You could also try alternating different full body routines every workout... I saw that you have some overlap. For example, instead of doing both leg press and squats, use only one per workout... it'll help only if you're able to go that much harder with one leg exercise per workout.

  18. #17
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harrison486
    I don't think I am bigger than you, but I do seem to be making gains faster than you are...

    I am still interested in HST. Some of you just make it sound like it does absolutley nothing. Would I be better off just sticking with my current full-body routine?

    BAN HIM.

    lol

  19. #18
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    Not in my house tuttut

  20. #19
    Banned KingJustin's Avatar
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    Ok so just to understand this, you have gained weight (a noticeable amount, ie 5+ lbs) in the last few ____ (months?) and it has been all fat?

  21. #20
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bizatch
    Ok so just to understand this, you have gained weight (a noticeable amount, ie 5+ lbs) in the last few ____ (months?) and it has been all fat?

    I'm up to 140lbs now, i was around 135 before...and yes my arms are pretty much identical size and i dont appear to really be growing other than putting on some pudge. My weights arent going up very much either, i've pretty much plateud for like the zillionith time in my life.

  22. #21
    Wannabebig Member
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    Personally, HST has worked well for me, both in terms of size and strength. I could never do unassisted dips before, but after 3 HST cycles, I could strap on an extra 45 lbs.
    If your current routine isn't working and you really think your diet is OK, I'd definitely give HST a try.

  23. #22
    Senior Member geoffgarcia's Avatar
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    what is your avg daily diet?

  24. #23
    Newd poster SquareHead's Avatar
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    HST works very well but you need to get your diet down then everything else will fall into play. It sounds to me like your getting very frustrated. To fix the problem you should log all your food and count calories, while also logging weight. Weigh your self once a morning and keep that in your log as well. Once you have your calories balanced so that your steadily but slowly gaining weight keep your calories around that amount (assuming your activity stays the same). Then look into some HST. If you start a journal on this site I am more than sure that you will get tons of help, I know I have.
    Old Journal


    " I'd give up a pinky or a toe or something I don't need those"
    -PwrMajt:

    "Remember, as long as you don't kick them in the head or use a weapon, it's only a misdemeanor." -JustinASU

    I nominate this thread for the Tim Nissen Award! -El P

  25. #24
    MilliVanilli
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    Quote Originally Posted by geoffgarcia
    what is your avg daily diet?

    Wake up;
    Breakfast
    Have an Opticen shake with milk or 3-4 eggs, whole wheat toast, glass of milk

    Snack on a piece of fruit and some crackers before lunch

    Lunch
    Peanutbutter and Jelly on whole wheat bread, or turkey and lettuce, yogurt, piece of fruit, two or three school sized milks...maybe something more if i can fit it into the lunch time

    I'm going to start throwing a tuna sandwhich on whole wheat toast in, in the afternoon

    Snack;
    1 or 3 Yogurts, some milk, maybe a piece of fruit

    Dinner;
    whatever is being made. Normally a meat(skinless chicken breast, steak, pork, etc.), some veggies, rice, salad, etc.

    Snack;
    1 to 3 Yogurts, milk, maybe some turkey if I have it, etc., etc.


    This is for the diet of a 18yr old, 5'8, 140lb male...by the time I'm done with snacking and everything I should be over my maintenance calories by atleast 200 or so

  26. #25
    Senior Member geoffgarcia's Avatar
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    u don't appear to be eating enough.
    You are close to 2k calories by my calculations...depending on what yogurts (since your have 3-8 of them a day) and quantity/composition of dinner
    and that is assuming your actually eating all this stuff every day.

    Not to mention you have plenty of spots in there for sat fat, depending on what ur eating, but you dont appear to be getting nearly enough EFA's

    From your diet, the reason ur not gaining weight is because ur just not eating enough and ur breakdown is questionable. really the only way any of us can help you is if you track your calories for 1-3 weeks and let us know your averages.

    _________on a side note
    HST is based on muscle behavior gleaned mostly from studies on rats and birds. On paper Haycock does a great job of construing snippets of data to backup his claims. But I haven't come across any human studies that backup his claims (or refute them for that matter)

    he basically makes 3 major claims
    1) don't train to failure, failure is counter productive, and its the tension that grows muscle. Failing on a set also caused CNS to pause longer than needed for recovery.
    2) train each muscle group ever 48 hours because thats when growth factors reset. (99% of the healing has been done)
    3) muscle memory is counter productive, so a frequent routine change or decreasing volume change is needed to keep muscles from forming resistance (memory) to a movement

    with secondary notes being
    1) HST is used for size, not strength
    2) decondition to flush muscle memory to aid in 3) from above
    3) train through muscle soreness (which u'd expect given #2 from above)

    what I haven't seen any support on his website for is:
    1) why the increase in weights over the 2 week segments. There are snippets here and there on progressive load but its super fuzzy
    2) where does he come up with "appropriate volume"

    and he doesn't mention why a 3 day full body routine would be better than a 6 day 2 workout split (maintaining volume levels)
    could be convenience/mental factor I assume...
    Last edited by geoffgarcia; 06-08-2004 at 10:37 AM.

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