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Thread: A perplexing question regarding excess caloric intake

  1. #1
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    A perplexing question regarding excess caloric intake

    Let's assume, for the sake of argument, that one has met one's daily caloric needs. If one is trying to add lean mass, albeit slowly, then which pre-bed meal, of the following two, should one eat?

    A) carbs and protein; pro: carbs and protein, when consumed in excess of total caloric needs, are less likely than fat to be stored as body fat. con: insulin is somewhat anagonistic to hgh.

    B) fats and protein; pro: fat retards digestion of protein; fat is necessary for hormonal regulation; and fat consumed in the absence of insulin is relatively difficult to store; con: fat is generally the most easily stored of all macronutrients.

    If I am incorrect on any of these facts, I apologize.

  2. #2
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    Monitored properly, I would go with A.

    Insulin is an (and the MOST) anabolic hormone. It is difficult to produce an insulin response without eating carbohydrates (just fat alone), unless gluconeogenesis were to happen, which is something you do not want as a bodybuilder.

    Fat is only the most easily stored macronutrient because it is so calorie dense, and will also remain in the digestive tract for longer than protein or carbs. Be sure to make it a whole food protein source before bed, and not something like whey which is easily and quickly digested.

    Tuna fish is a prime candidate.

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    Thanks for the reply.

    What is your opinion of the theory that carbs eaten before bed, especially in times of caloric excess, are easily stored as body fat?

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    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    C) Carbs, Protien, and fats.
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
    "You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
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    Why is C) better than A) or B)?

  6. #6
    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    Protein = good for muscles
    Carbs = good for muscles (glycogen) and insulin
    Fats = Good for hormonal balance, good for calories.

    The main thing is to get more calories than you need.
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
    "You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
    I has a blog.
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  7. #7
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    Thanks for your help.

    The reason I ask is that I currently consume 300 g carbs, 50 g good fat, and at least 150 g complete protein. My daily caloric intake ranges from 2600-2800 calories (I know that the macronutrients don't equal the total caloric figure; this is because of the incomplete protein, found in oatmeal, brown rice, etc... that I consume)

    I currently eat no carbs before bed, eating instead two omega-3 enriched egg yolks with three egg whites.

    Should I change this? Oh, I am 18, 5'7'', male, and 136 lbs.
    Last edited by unev_en; 11-27-2001 at 10:22 AM.

  8. #8
    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    I would.

    But, then, I wouldn't be focusing on the macronutrient breakdown of my pre-bed meal.

    Focus on the big stuff.

    Your protein intake looks great. I'd bump fat up a little and carbs down a little. With that big a caloric excess, I might even be inclined to put more protein in place of some carbs, too.

    What you eat before bed isn't going to matter all that much. What you eat all day does.
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
    "You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
    I has a blog.
    I has a facebook.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Wizard's Avatar
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    Don't eat anything at all before bed.(3-4 hours)Maybe some protein is ok though.

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    With this caloric intake, I've gained roughly 10 pounds in six months, while my bf% has remained relatively unchanged, so this caloric intake is not so excessive.

    So more fat and less carbs, even though carbs currently comprise less than half of my daily caloric intake?

    And wizard, any particular reason for your statement? Thanks again for all the replies.
    Last edited by unev_en; 11-27-2001 at 11:21 AM.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Avatar's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Wizard
    Don't eat anything at all before bed.(3-4 hours)Maybe some protein is ok though.
    why not eat anything before bed wiz?
    "They will spend their nights dreaming of six-pack
    abs and a rock hard physique, little do they realize eventually we will reach
    our goal and they will be dreaming of the body we walk around with every
    day…only then will they understand." -- Severed Ties

    "There are 6 billion people in this world, and I'm #1." -- me

  12. #12
    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    With this caloric intake, I've gained roughly 10 pounds in six months, while my bf% has remained relatively unchanged; though it may appear to be, it isn't that large of a caloric excess.

    ** Wow. You must have a screaming metabolism. 10 pounds in 6 months isn't bad, though. Keep at it. I have some interesting ideas (not mine, mostly) for big weight gain if you are interested.

    So more fat and less carbs, even though carbs currently comprise less than half of my daily caloric intake?

    ** That's what I would do. Big picture, worry about calories, protein, fat, carbs. In that order.

    Get your caloric intake right, then get your protein right, then make sure you are getting plenty of 'good' fats, and not restricting fat intake to the poin thtat it hurts your hormone production, then make sure you get enough carbs. Carbs is the easy one.
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
    "You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
    I has a blog.
    I has a facebook.

  13. #13
    Milk Junkie Ironman15's Avatar
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    I'd like to hear some interesting ideas for weight gain. I'm 5'6" 125lbs. and 16. I eat about 3500 calories a day which is mainly from milk though but I'd like some better ideas for gaining weight.
    5'6"
    160lbs
    480x1 deadlift
    315x5 squat (atf)
    260x1 bench

    "He's used to doing the jerk first, then the clean." -Xian

    "Eat more? I am already consuming more than 2500 cals a day." -Danpiel

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    Thanks again.

    How much fat would you recommend?

  15. #15
    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    Personally, I'd set my protein requirement (mine is about 1g per pound of Paul), then split the remaning calories evenly between carbs and fats... perhaps 60/40 carbs/fats.

    Some of it depends on what you like, as well.

    I would never go lower than 15% of total cals from fat.

    Buling ideas for a 16 year old? Drink more milk, and eat everything your mom makes for you. Ask for seconds. You'll grow.
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
    "You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
    I has a blog.
    I has a facebook.

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