The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    eek... it's lil' Fixation! fixationdarknes's Avatar
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    I was thinking about adding some Cleans to my routine...

    ...because of how you guys have said they're so awesome, and how they're so great for giving you power and explosiveness.

    Here's my current lifting routine:

    ~~~Monday(Legs)
    --Squats/ATF Squats
    -Calf Raises
    -SLDL

    ~~~Wednesday(Chest)
    --Flat BB Bench/Incline BB Bench
    -Incline DB Bench/Flat DB Bench
    -DB Chest Flys
    -Dips

    ~~~Friday(Back)
    --Deadlifts
    -Chinups
    -Bent-over BB Rows
    -Shrugs

    Where would be the best place to add Cleans in there. Does it need its own day? If so, how shall I go about doing it?
    Lifting Journal
    Age: 20, Height: 5'7", Weight: 165, Deadlift: 405, 9.5" Squat: 230 x 10, Bench: 195 (3x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by fatrb38
    I try to visualize that my girlfriend is under the weight and I have to push the weight up to save her. Of course it doesn't work and I just laugh as I think about the weight slowly crushing her bones. Then I remember it's me under the weight and give 200% effort to push it back up.

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  3. #2
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    i do cleans, imho a top priority is that they arent on a deadlift day or a squat day. either its own day or on your chest day (i know its not chest, but you see where im coming from with this, it cant be a similar motion in it to something your doing that day)

    also, a mistake i made this very morning was adding snatches into today right before military press. i didnt think it would have that same effect, maybe (since im lifting at home) i could just do one at the end of the day and the other at the beginning. it was mostly an just upper-body fatigue in the shoulders rather than they actual slight damage that causes hypertrophy. so if you feel fatigued after doing them, its gonna be hard to lift. depending on how you feel after doing a few solid sets that will determine whether it needs its own day or at least time of the day.

  4. #3
    eek... it's lil' Fixation! fixationdarknes's Avatar
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    Alright, so do you think I should try doing it on my chest day, and if I feel too fatigued, then put it on its own day or something?
    Lifting Journal
    Age: 20, Height: 5'7", Weight: 165, Deadlift: 405, 9.5" Squat: 230 x 10, Bench: 195 (3x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by fatrb38
    I try to visualize that my girlfriend is under the weight and I have to push the weight up to save her. Of course it doesn't work and I just laugh as I think about the weight slowly crushing her bones. Then I remember it's me under the weight and give 200% effort to push it back up.

  5. #4
    I wannabebig!
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    i vote for fixation to have his own sub forum.

  6. #5
    Canucks Fan Hockey66's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryuage
    i vote for fixation to have his own sub forum.
    LOL!
    Age: 18
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  7. #6
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    basically thats what im suggesting fix.

  8. #7
    Player Hater PowerManDL's Avatar
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    LOL

    You should see the OL workout I did in the summer/fall if you think doing cleans and snatches will "fatigue" a workout.
    Vin Diesel has a fever.. and the only prescription is more cowbell.

    Budiak: That girl I maced
    Budiak: macked
    Budiak: heh maced
    Budiak: I wish

    ShmrckPmp5: a good thing people can't fire guns through the computer...your ass would have been shot years ago

    Y2A 47: youre smooth as hell
    Y2A 47: thats why you get outta tickets, and into panties

    galileo: you're a fucking beast and I hate you
    galileo: hate

    assgrabbers are never subtile, they will grabb ass whereever they go,public or not, I know the type, because I am one. - Rock

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by PowerManDL
    LOL

    You should see the OL workout I did in the summer/fall if you think doing cleans and snatches will "fatigue" a workout.
    typical powermandl response.

    single word (or abbreviation), sometimes followed by a dipshi* statement that he doesnt support.

    thats not to say i dont believe you, you do usually provide useful information when your provide any at all... but if your just gonna say something like that and not tell us anything, get lost.

  10. #9
    Player Hater PowerManDL's Avatar
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    Ah, so your lovely insight on snatches being a fatiguing exercise, though you've obviously got no idea on how to properly program them, is so much more valuable, yes?
    Vin Diesel has a fever.. and the only prescription is more cowbell.

    Budiak: That girl I maced
    Budiak: macked
    Budiak: heh maced
    Budiak: I wish

    ShmrckPmp5: a good thing people can't fire guns through the computer...your ass would have been shot years ago

    Y2A 47: youre smooth as hell
    Y2A 47: thats why you get outta tickets, and into panties

    galileo: you're a fucking beast and I hate you
    galileo: hate

    assgrabbers are never subtile, they will grabb ass whereever they go,public or not, I know the type, because I am one. - Rock

  11. #10
    eek... it's lil' Fixation! fixationdarknes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryuage
    i vote for fixation to have his own sub forum.
    Haha, thanks. I don't know why I ask so many questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by PowerManDL
    Ah, so your lovely insight on snatches being a fatiguing exercise, though you've obviously got no idea on how to properly program them, is so much more valuable, yes?
    What are snatches...snatch grip deadlifts?

    Also, yes, you're right, I don't know how to set up the program with cleans and snatches.
    Lifting Journal
    Age: 20, Height: 5'7", Weight: 165, Deadlift: 405, 9.5" Squat: 230 x 10, Bench: 195 (3x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by fatrb38
    I try to visualize that my girlfriend is under the weight and I have to push the weight up to save her. Of course it doesn't work and I just laugh as I think about the weight slowly crushing her bones. Then I remember it's me under the weight and give 200% effort to push it back up.

  12. #11
    Player Hater PowerManDL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fixationdarknes
    Also, yes, you're right, I don't know how to set up the program with cleans and snatches.
    That wasn't directed at you.

    It was directed at the slightly less n00b lifter that ordained himself knowledgable on the subject but didn't like being offered a contrary viewpoint.
    Vin Diesel has a fever.. and the only prescription is more cowbell.

    Budiak: That girl I maced
    Budiak: macked
    Budiak: heh maced
    Budiak: I wish

    ShmrckPmp5: a good thing people can't fire guns through the computer...your ass would have been shot years ago

    Y2A 47: youre smooth as hell
    Y2A 47: thats why you get outta tickets, and into panties

    galileo: you're a fucking beast and I hate you
    galileo: hate

    assgrabbers are never subtile, they will grabb ass whereever they go,public or not, I know the type, because I am one. - Rock

  13. #12
    eek... it's lil' Fixation! fixationdarknes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PowerManDL
    That wasn't directed at you.

    It was directed at the slightly less n00b lifter that ordained himself knowledgable on the subject but didn't like being offered a contrary viewpoint.
    O
    Lifting Journal
    Age: 20, Height: 5'7", Weight: 165, Deadlift: 405, 9.5" Squat: 230 x 10, Bench: 195 (3x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by fatrb38
    I try to visualize that my girlfriend is under the weight and I have to push the weight up to save her. Of course it doesn't work and I just laugh as I think about the weight slowly crushing her bones. Then I remember it's me under the weight and give 200% effort to push it back up.

  14. #13
    Formerly Nick Hatfield SW's Avatar
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    Put'em on chest day, they work the crap outta alot of you and are awkward to distinguish between back/leg/upper/lower.
    "You can take control of my mind and my body, but there is one thing a Saiyan always keeps.... his PRIDE!"- Vegeta

    My Exploits

  15. #14
    eek... it's lil' Fixation! fixationdarknes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superior_will
    Put'em on chest day, they work the crap outta alot of you and are awkward to distinguish between back/leg/upper/lower.
    I haven't tried it yet, but I would imagine like jack said that it might fatigue me too much for my Chest and make me bench less. If that's the case, should I just not do Cleans? Because I really want to do them, but I don't wanna impede my ability to do other exercises.
    Lifting Journal
    Age: 20, Height: 5'7", Weight: 165, Deadlift: 405, 9.5" Squat: 230 x 10, Bench: 195 (3x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by fatrb38
    I try to visualize that my girlfriend is under the weight and I have to push the weight up to save her. Of course it doesn't work and I just laugh as I think about the weight slowly crushing her bones. Then I remember it's me under the weight and give 200% effort to push it back up.

  16. #15
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    i dont like an opposite viewpoint??

    if only you had actually provided a viewpoint you just made some dumb@$$ blanket statement and ran off. you didnt even tell us how your routine went, which would have made your post somewhat helpful.

    lets look at how this started, i showed up and tried to help. notice i never once claimed to know what i was talking about, and because of this i came up with multiple ideas he could try. i also included an example of when i myself screwed something up, VERY recently. so its obvious im not trying to pretend im an expert here. yet still you said:

    Quote Originally Posted by PowerManDL
    It was directed at the slightly less n00b lifter that ordained himself knowledgable on the subject but didn't like being offered a contrary viewpoint.
    lets look at what happened soon afteri showed up, you showed up, flamed me, and left without ever once answering fix's question.

    btw fix snatches look like this:

    http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...ts/Snatch.html

    edit: btw fix, try them on chest day. ive done cleans on bench day and not really noticed much difference if any at all. snatches do seem to be harder on the upper body, but both are mainly a shoulders thing. yes, i guess they could put you under on bench, but its worth at least one try.

    then when you (powermandl) are further flaming me you refer to me as the 'slightly less n00b'. what the FUCK man, you are flaming him too??

    this board would be better off without you.
    Last edited by jack_of_all; 03-12-2005 at 07:00 AM.

  17. #16
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    I'd do them on back day. You're already hitting the primary muscles involved with the clean when you dead and shrug so why not polish them off with cleans?

  18. #17
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    slight hi-jack but when doing clean and presses/jerks do you guys do it like the video on exrx.net and once you stand up pause go back down then press up. cus i just come exploding straight up from the squat into the press.

    i too don't know what day to put them on so i just stick em on leg day or shoulder/bi/tri day, depending on when i feel like doing them. but if your not doing a press i'd prob. stick em on leg day. but whatever

  19. #18
    mrelwooddowd Patz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack_of_all
    this board would be better off without you.
    Yeah, but he's a mod and you're not.

    I agree, powerman's posts can leave us hangning at times, but I don't think it's intentional. When he does provide more insight, it's good information. You ought to watch the F***'s though, as it can get you banned and is unnecessary to get your point across.
    Last edited by Patz; 03-12-2005 at 03:55 PM.
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  20. #19
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    in this case it was necassary (to clarify, its a direct attack on him that i took more time to bypass the censor. it illustraits just how pissed i am)

    and 'at times' means usually.

    if he wanted to be helpful he sure as heck could, but hes made his choice. and yes, hes a mod and im not, but if hes honestly giving me shi* he cant expect me to just take it 100% of the time.
    Last edited by jack_of_all; 03-12-2005 at 04:20 PM.

  21. #20
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    I went to a clinic last weekend about lifting technique. The guy running the clinic said that you get very little work from the actual catch of the weight, bringing it to your chest. He said that the majority of work is in the explosion part of bringing the weight from the ground and exploding onto your toes while shrugging the weight, power shrugs. I have also heard this from another strength coach at a clinic and several strength and conditioning coaches for various colleges. This technique dramatically reduces the risk of being injured. You can also do them in a cage with pins set so you don't go as low and work more on explosion with heavier weights. Since they are more of a total body movement you should try them on different days. I do power shrugs on my lower body day after squats. The biggest reason being that my traps get fried and if I did them on my upper day I wouldn't be able to squat two days later.
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  22. #21
    Go Heels! MixmasterNash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gordo
    He said that the majority of work is in the explosion part of bringing the weight from the ground and exploding onto your toes while shrugging the weight, power shrugs. I have also heard this from another strength coach at a clinic and several strength and conditioning coaches for various colleges. This technique dramatically reduces the risk of being injured. ... I do power shrugs on my lower body day after squats.


    This is an excellent point. The real reason to bother with catching the clean at the top is in preparation for a jerk or press. If you're just working the clean portion, there are excellent alternatives like Gordo has mentioned.

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  23. #22
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    I agree on doing power cleans on a day when you don't do squat/deadlifts...because if you don't, your lower back will be killing you (or at least thats what happens to me)

    This is what I did friday:

    Power cleans, squats, deadlifts, calf raises, RDLs, and a lot of ab work (leg throwdowns, etc), and my lower back is pretty damn sore.

  24. #23
    eek... it's lil' Fixation! fixationdarknes's Avatar
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    Alright, thanks guys. But are snatches good too? Or should I just do cleans?
    Lifting Journal
    Age: 20, Height: 5'7", Weight: 165, Deadlift: 405, 9.5" Squat: 230 x 10, Bench: 195 (3x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by fatrb38
    I try to visualize that my girlfriend is under the weight and I have to push the weight up to save her. Of course it doesn't work and I just laugh as I think about the weight slowly crushing her bones. Then I remember it's me under the weight and give 200% effort to push it back up.

  25. #24
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    imho, more variety=more real-world usable gains

    just so there is no more confusion... im not an expert on this though

    in general i also find that doing both is more fun and makes things less repetetive. but cleans are still the better lift overall imho.

  26. #25
    mrelwooddowd Patz's Avatar
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    When you guys do cleans, do you lower the weight slowly or just drop it like the guy on the commercial (granted he had rubberized weights)? I would think that everyone lowers it, but that would fatigue me quite a bit. But maybe that's the point, huh?
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