Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 51 to 75 of 116

Thread: Baby Got Back by MariAnne Anderson - Feb 18th 2006

  1. #51
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    Weight gain doesn't depend on strength! It depends on diet!

    It sounds to me like you need to eat more!

    Read the Hypertrophy primer. You may find that information helpful.

  2. #52
    Scorpion32
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    110
    Thank you for your help! I learned a lot this evening!

  3. #53

  4. #54
    Wannabebig Member civrob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    75
    ok i have a quick question.

    how long on average does the workout last. Im guessing with doing a 4 day split workout the sessions are quite short.

    Im taking this routine a day at a time.

    Day one, ive selected the following

    T-bar rows - 10*/8/8/6
    Dumbell press - 10*/8/8/6
    standing calves - 8/8/8/8

    * means warm up. last set at 6 will generally notch it up a weight and hit close to failure. Is it me or is the exercise a little short?
    Last edited by civrob; 02-26-2007 at 10:38 AM.
    Stats

    Researching starting in feb 2007 ready and knowledgeable

  5. #55
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    Civrob - you're skipping the 5x5s?

    Read the summary at the end of the article - you might find that helpful.

    Workout usually takes me under an hour. Longer if I make friends.

  6. #56
    Wannabebig Member civrob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    75
    I misinterpreted the workout... ive had another go here

    Thickness back (as labelled horizontal pulling)
    T-bar rows - 5x5
    Bent-over rows 10*/8/8/8

    Chest
    Dumbell press - 10*/8/8/8
    standing calves - 8/8/8/8
    abs weighted crunches 8/8/8

    * means warm up. Could i change t-bar rows for regular deadlifts? Where can i find more info on the 5x5 range?
    Stats

    Researching starting in feb 2007 ready and knowledgeable

  7. #57

  8. #58
    Wannabebig Member civrob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    75
    I read it up hypertrophy primer just did a quick search,

    did my first session in the gym today with BGB... must say its more complex than the last routine which was a variation of wbb1. I understand more now about the choices in bgb.

    Onwards and upwards now
    Stats

    Researching starting in feb 2007 ready and knowledgeable

  9. #59

  10. #60
    heading to 195
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    greatness
    Posts
    950
    I offered this as a workout routine to my friend and he said something to the effect of being concerned about working two major muscle groups at the same time, i.e. chest/back. Also, said something about muscles not getting enough nutrients with the way this is set up. What is he talking about? I'm imagining he doesn't know.
    Last edited by snow; 03-06-2007 at 08:49 PM.

  11. #61
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    You lost me with the muscles not getting enough nutrients.

    That's awesome.

    The muscles worked are agonist antagonist pairs. There are numerous advantages to training this way. Your friend needs to do some reading.

  12. #62
    heading to 195
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    greatness
    Posts
    950
    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    You lost me with the muscles not getting enough nutrients.

    That's awesome.

    The muscles worked are agonist antagonist pairs. There are numerous advantages to training this way. Your friend needs to do some reading.
    I think he wanted to pretend to know what he was talking about.

  13. #63
    Weaker
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    391

    Re, De, Me

    Sorry! Yet another question, just wanna make sure i'm not gonna kill myself.

    First of all, i love this split! In comparison to what i used to be doing: 4 excercises for basically everything, no legs, and always 4 sets of 10 reps, it's a real motivation booster because i don't actually have todo as much...also i love deadlifting and squatting (which i never did before).

    I added another leg day, (before day 1), simply because i HATE sucking at squats, and unfortunately, i do not do good mornings, mainly due to the fact that i don't want to explain to everyone in my gym that i am not attempting to squat, and that i am in fact doing GM's.

    Anyhoo, my question is:
    Would it be possible to dedicate each week to different types of efforts (or whatever the following is called)? For example, one week do ME bench, the next week do DE bench, then the week after do RE bench?

    My plan for doing legs 3 days a week, and squatting on each of those days was to basically max out on one day, speed work on the other, and higher reps on the other.

    Could i do this? Would it work? Or have i once again completely misunderstood?

    Thanks in advance.
    Journal

    Age: 21
    BW: 12st/1168lbs
    Height: 5'9"
    Big hiatus, deciding on new goals...

  14. #64
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    Are you talking about a Westside-type paradigm? I'm not 100% clear of what it is you intend to do.

    I am nowhere near well-versed in conjugated periodization, but many of our members are. That being said, the principal concept I illustrate in about in BGB is a particular arrangement of push and pull movements. I set it up with 5x5s and 3x8-12s, but it's by no means the only way to do so.

    My feeling is that conjugated periodization would be a great way to apply these movements. I'd welcome input on people who train this way. Hell, I may try it myself for a change of pace!

  15. #65
    Weaker
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    391
    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    Are you talking about a Westside-type paradigm? I'm not 100% clear of what it is you intend to do.

    I am nowhere near well-versed in conjugated periodization, but many of our members are. That being said, the principal concept I illustrate in about in BGB is a particular arrangement of push and pull movements. I set it up with 5x5s and 3x8-12s, but it's by no means the only way to do so.

    My feeling is that conjugated periodization would be a great way to apply these movements. I'd welcome input on people who train this way. Hell, I may try it myself for a change of pace!
    I know i'm still a serious n00b, but i'm pretty sure that the words 'conjugated perdiodization' are kind of what i mean.

    I'll try and put it more simply.

    Take bench press, for example:
    Week 1 do:
    Maximal Effort Bench Press (on horizontal push/pull day, ofcourse)
    Either working up to a 1RM, or keeping weight high, reps low.

    Obviously followed by the rest of the split for that week.


    Then on week 2 do:
    Dynamic Effort Bench Press
    A certain percentage of your 1RM for speed work (i think thats what dynamic effort is).

    Again, obviously followed by the rest of the split.

    Week 3 do:
    Repeated Effort Bench Press
    Again, a lower percentage of your 1RM for reps, to failure (?).

    Obviously followed by the rest of the split.

    I just took bench press as an example to make it look simpler, i tend to ramble on!

    Sorry if i don't know what the hell i'm talking about.
    Journal

    Age: 21
    BW: 12st/1168lbs
    Height: 5'9"
    Big hiatus, deciding on new goals...

  16. #66
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    Portboy, we're both newbs here - I haven't tried this approach either.

    So would you do this for the horizontal pulling movement as well for those days? Any Westside aficionados care to chime in here with suggestions?

  17. #67
    Weaker
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    391
    Quote Originally Posted by Built View Post
    Portboy, we're both newbs here - I haven't tried this approach either.

    So would you do this for the horizontal pulling movement as well for those days? Any Westside aficionados care to chime in here with suggestions?
    Actually i was only thinking about doing it to assist and hopefully improve the 'big three' lifts, but obviously i'm sure it can expand into other movements too.

    Gah! I don't know.
    Journal

    Age: 21
    BW: 12st/1168lbs
    Height: 5'9"
    Big hiatus, deciding on new goals...

  18. #68

  19. #69
    Iron4Life
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Sitting on cold Granite
    Posts
    3,313
    Quote Originally Posted by Portboy View Post
    Actually i was only thinking about doing it to assist and hopefully improve the 'big three' lifts, but obviously i'm sure it can expand into other movements too.

    Gah! I don't know.
    Hey Portboy.. Built asked me to check in here and see if I could help..
    From what I'm reading above, it sounds like you are trying to combine the BGB program with a Westside/conjugated periodization type of effort. SOunds interesting...

    But what worries me, is your statements like above... you really got to know what your want to do first. So I went to your journal and cut out these snippets - from your Jan. 1 2007 post: (and it might actually be better to cary on this conversation there... but for now..)
    Quote Originally Posted by Portboy View Post
    I've been lifting for about a year now, only 6 or 7 weeks of that has been serious, since i: started BGB, realised i had to train legs, and realised that i actually had to eat to get bigger!
    Current stats
    Age: 17
    Bodyweight: 170lbs (77kg)
    Squat: 176lbs x 8 (80kg)
    Deadlift: 264lbs x 4 (120kg)
    Bench: 198lbs x 1 (90kg)

    i basically make it my mission each day to eat as much as possible. I think i'm supposed to be aiming for about 3000 to 4000 calories (attempting a bulk), maybe just reaching 3000, but probably an average of about 2000.

    My goals, by the end of the year are:
    Deadlift: 396lbs (180kg)
    Squat: 308lbs (140kg)
    Bench: 264lbs (120kg)
    And I see recently you've got new PRs in Squats = 100kg/220lbsx5 and DLs = 140kg/308lbsx2... so this is fantastic news.. and great progress.

    So with about 4-5 months of using BgB, you made it about half way to your very aggressive goals. And now you want to change things up. Does all this sound Right?

    If so.. here would be my advice... based mainly upon your age and goals.

    You are 17, almost NOTHING you do in the weightroom is going to be WRONG or hurt you ((unless you use bad form)). Especially if you eat enough. You will gain both mass and strength... you gotta love youth.

    However, although you want your BIG 3 to increase significantly, you don't actually say that you want to compete in a PL competition. Maybe somewhere else you do...

    So basically you are creating yourself worry for NO reason. Why? You are progressing!! You have gain some weight - so I assume mass. Stop worrying!!!

    If I was going to combine the 2 programs, I might do it a bit differently. Keep the BGB formula, but instead of spliting up ME, DE and RE across weeks, I might split them up across workouts.. (Westside/conjugated periodization says not to do the same effort twice in a row).. perhaps something like this:

    Week 1:
    DAY 1 - HORIZONTAL PUSH PULL
    Horizontal plane back (pull)
    ME Horizontal plane chest (push)
    DAY 2 - DE QUAD DOMINANT LEGS
    DAY 3 - VERTICAL PUSH/PULL
    Vertical plane back (pull)
    RE Vertical plane shoulders (push)
    DAY 4 – ME HIP/HAMSTRING DOMINANT LEGS
    Week 2:
    DAY 1 - HORIZONTAL PUSH PULL
    Horizontal plane back (pull)
    DE Horizontal plane chest (push)
    DAY 2 - RE QUAD DOMINANT LEGS
    DAY 3 - VERTICAL PUSH/PULL
    Vertical plane back (pull)
    ME Vertical plane shoulders (push)
    DAY 4 – DE HIP/HAMSTRING DOMINANT LEGS
    Week 3:
    DAY 1 - HORIZONTAL PUSH PULL
    Horizontal plane back (pull)
    RE Horizontal plane chest (push)
    DAY 2 - ME QUAD DOMINANT LEGS
    DAY 3 - VERTICAL PUSH/PULL
    Vertical plane back (pull)
    DE Vertical plane shoulders (push)
    DAY 4 – RE HIP/HAMSTRING DOMINANT LEGS
    Repeat
    Your idea combining the 2 types of training & programs sounds cool. You can give it a try for a few months (maybe 4-5 like the basic BGB program) and see what kind of results you have by the end of August. If you haven't progressed in the Big 3 like you want, then perhaps start being stricter to the Westside program.

    And you never know, you are 17 so you will probably change your mind by August.. maybe even be a BB'er or Olympic lifter.

    And perhaps the best thing you can do is have FUN!! INstead of worrying, think of this like you were a mad scientist!! And you are experimenting (programs, exercises, sets, reps, etc.) and with direct access to the best laboratory (your body). Now use all the tools (brains) you can to think up new and exciting ways to get different results!!! Dude, the experimenting, results and creativity are endless!!! Have Fun.

    And GL with your goals. If you know what they are...

  20. #70
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    Bear, you're WONDERFUL! Thank you!

    I'm going to do this myself at the end of my cut. I want to get some numbers up myself, and this sounds interesting as hell!

  21. #71
    Weaker
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    391
    Quote Originally Posted by bearwolf View Post
    Hey Portboy.. Built asked me to check in here and see if I could help..
    From what I'm reading above, it sounds like you are trying to combine the BGB program with a Westside/conjugated periodization type of effort. SOunds interesting...

    But what worries me, is your statements like above... you really got to know what your want to do first. So I went to your journal and cut out these snippets - from your Jan. 1 2007 post: (and it might actually be better to cary on this conversation there... but for now..)


    And I see recently you've got new PRs in Squats = 100kg/220lbsx5 and DLs = 140kg/308lbsx2... so this is fantastic news.. and great progress.

    So with about 4-5 months of using BgB, you made it about half way to your very aggressive goals. And now you want to change things up. Does all this sound Right?

    If so.. here would be my advice... based mainly upon your age and goals.

    You are 17, almost NOTHING you do in the weightroom is going to be WRONG or hurt you ((unless you use bad form)). Especially if you eat enough. You will gain both mass and strength... you gotta love youth.

    However, although you want your BIG 3 to increase significantly, you don't actually say that you want to compete in a PL competition. Maybe somewhere else you do...

    So basically you are creating yourself worry for NO reason. Why? You are progressing!! You have gain some weight - so I assume mass. Stop worrying!!!

    If I was going to combine the 2 programs, I might do it a bit differently. Keep the BGB formula, but instead of spliting up ME, DE and RE across weeks, I might split them up across workouts.. (Westside/conjugated periodization says not to do the same effort twice in a row).. perhaps something like this:

    Week 1:
    DAY 1 - HORIZONTAL PUSH PULL
    Horizontal plane back (pull)
    ME Horizontal plane chest (push)
    DAY 2 - DE QUAD DOMINANT LEGS
    DAY 3 - VERTICAL PUSH/PULL
    Vertical plane back (pull)
    RE Vertical plane shoulders (push)
    DAY 4 – ME HIP/HAMSTRING DOMINANT LEGS
    Week 2:
    DAY 1 - HORIZONTAL PUSH PULL
    Horizontal plane back (pull)
    DE Horizontal plane chest (push)
    DAY 2 - RE QUAD DOMINANT LEGS
    DAY 3 - VERTICAL PUSH/PULL
    Vertical plane back (pull)
    ME Vertical plane shoulders (push)
    DAY 4 – DE HIP/HAMSTRING DOMINANT LEGS
    Week 3:
    DAY 1 - HORIZONTAL PUSH PULL
    Horizontal plane back (pull)
    RE Horizontal plane chest (push)
    DAY 2 - ME QUAD DOMINANT LEGS
    DAY 3 - VERTICAL PUSH/PULL
    Vertical plane back (pull)
    DE Vertical plane shoulders (push)
    DAY 4 – RE HIP/HAMSTRING DOMINANT LEGS
    Repeat
    Your idea combining the 2 types of training & programs sounds cool. You can give it a try for a few months (maybe 4-5 like the basic BGB program) and see what kind of results you have by the end of August. If you haven't progressed in the Big 3 like you want, then perhaps start being stricter to the Westside program.

    And you never know, you are 17 so you will probably change your mind by August.. maybe even be a BB'er or Olympic lifter.

    And perhaps the best thing you can do is have FUN!! INstead of worrying, think of this like you were a mad scientist!! And you are experimenting (programs, exercises, sets, reps, etc.) and with direct access to the best laboratory (your body). Now use all the tools (brains) you can to think up new and exciting ways to get different results!!! Dude, the experimenting, results and creativity are endless!!! Have Fun.

    And GL with your goals. If you know what they are...
    Thankyou Bearwolf!

    Thanks alot for writing this up! I suppose you're right about me reaching goals, so i suppose that maybe i don't need todo this. Maybe i'm hungry for strength. Although to me the weights i'm doing seem like alot, i know that in the grand spectrum of lifting i've barely made a dent.

    When i look at people like Fuzzy and Stump i just wanna kick myself, and it's also why i don't think i really have any significant future for olympic lifting or bodybuilding (lol but thankyou for suggesting it); i feel that if i was gonna be any good i should be lifting alot more than i am now (plus i'm about 5'9" and quite narrow framed so BB'ing is out the window).

    In this case, i'll probably stick to BGB, because as you said i am reaching my goals, so i guess i don't need to be changing things up. And yeah, i do have to make myself worry too much!

    THANKYOU! THANKYOU! THANKYOU!

    And THANKYOU to Built for the help
    Journal

    Age: 21
    BW: 12st/1168lbs
    Height: 5'9"
    Big hiatus, deciding on new goals...

  22. #72
    Iron4Life
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Sitting on cold Granite
    Posts
    3,313
    Portboy.. I put my reply in your journal, so we don't hijack this BGB thread too much.. in short, again you are worrying too much...

  23. #73
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,396
    Portboy why not just use a standard westside barbell template?

  24. #74
    Senior Member HeavyBomber's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Granger Indiana, USA
    Posts
    2,164
    There are two articles that are must reads for anyone learning about conjugate periodization.

    To understand conjugate you need to first understand linear periodization:

    http://www.elitefts.com/documents/pe...le__part_1.htm

    The second article delves into conjugate:

    http://www.elitefts.com/documents/pe...le__part_2.htm

    There are a number of excellent articles on Westside and strength training in general on:

    http://www.elitefts.com/articles/Cur...es/default.asp
    Last edited by HeavyBomber; 04-19-2007 at 08:17 PM.

  25. #75
    Just watch me ... Built's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    9,912
    Bearwolf, threadjack away - your replies are interesting to me.
    Tommy, HeavyBomber - thank you very much for your help and suggestions.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •