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Thread: Muscle Burn

  1. #1
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Muscle Burn

    A study that was published in the Canadian Journal Of Applied Phisiology (1997, 22:244-255) showed that there was a direct correlation between higher levels of lactic acid and the release of GH.

    This would mean that the more of a muscle "burn" one gets the greater their chances are of stimulating the release of GH?
    This would ultimatley lead to more muscle mass.

    Your thoughts?
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    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Avatar's Avatar
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    the burn doesn't ultimately lead to more muscle mass. To get that burn you sometimes would have to do high reps and we know thats not the most effective way to build muscle.

    For example, performing 100 reps of squats and receiving a tremendous burn and releasing a ton of hGH obviously isn't more effective than doing 6-15 reps.
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  3. #3
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    i've read about this before in some old threads here, but it never really seemed like anyone came to a consensus....or maybe i was reading it wrong

    personally, I can do sets to faliure and not feel a burn (with a low to med rep's), but with high rep sets i seem to feel a much greater burn before i get to faliure...and this leads to avatars answer above
    Last edited by goobermor; 01-23-2002 at 06:32 PM.

  4. #4
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Avatar
    the burn doesn't ultimately lead to more muscle mass. To get that burn you sometimes would have to do high reps and we know thats not the most effective way to build muscle.

    For example, performing 100 reps of squats and receiving a tremendous burn and releasing a ton of hGH obviously isn't more effective than doing 6-15 reps.
    *** Isn't part of strength training for muscle, to manipulate the hormones so they allow one to induce a greater response from the endocrine system?
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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  5. #5
    MA's Bionic Creation syntekz's Avatar
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    What about the burn that you don't get when training.

    Have you ever just flexed your biceps as hard as you can and they kind of cramp up and burn like hell? Is that lactic acid?

  6. #6
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Originally posted by syntekz
    What about the burn that you don't get when training.

    Have you ever just flexed your biceps as hard as you can and they kind of cramp up and burn like hell? Is that lactic acid?
    *** That is a form of training called "isometrics". And yes that is lactic acid.
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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  7. #7
    Bigger fewl
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    I start to get a tremendous amount of burn from just 8-12 reps. I think a 20 rep squat or deadlift is a good example of an exercise that takes advantage of GH release.
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    I read an article ealier about challlenging not only your strength but your endurance this will add in maxmizing strength and growth....

    Basically do 1/2 or 2/3s of your exercises with 4-6 rep sets then challenge your self with a lighter waeight and knock out a few 60-80 rep sets in a different exercise. Maximizes both areas and should absolutly kill you. Of course changing routinues every once in a while is a good thing. Thats what i read.

    But I am new and to tell you the truth I woul't know?

    It did also say your muscles have two types of fibres and that you can hit them both doing max weight reps and

  9. #9
    Hardcore, what else?
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    Originally posted by Maki Riddington


    *** Isn't part of strength training for muscle, to manipulate the hormones so they allow one to induce a greater response from the endocrine system?
    This would only be part of the picture.
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  10. #10
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    And...... of course progressive overload. Which can be done using a load that causes this "burn".

    Don't get me wrong guys, I'm not saying this is correct. I'm just throwing this out here.
    Maki Fit Blog

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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  11. #11
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    Guess I'll just pop in another question here too

    Isn't trying to get a really good burn from your muscles by adding to your workout a bad thing?....Seems like your trying to over do your workout, unless you adjust it, and take sets away from your original workout to add in the high rep sets.
    Last edited by goobermor; 01-23-2002 at 10:25 PM.

  12. #12
    MA's Bionic Creation syntekz's Avatar
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    I've gotten lactic acid build up from doing sets of 8 or even 6. So it isn't exclusive to just high reps.

  13. #13
    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    The question to ask is:

    Is that increased Gh enough to make much, if any, of a difference?
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
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  14. #14
    MA's Bionic Creation syntekz's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Paul Stagg
    Is that increased Gh enough to make much, if any, of a difference?
    Any increase is better than none. It all will add up.


    It's just like a 401k. Little bit at a time adds up.

  15. #15
    As I Am Paul Stagg's Avatar
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    Fair enough.

    The issue I think we also run into is focusing on this little stuff (getting a burn) and missing the big picture, which is that progression from workout to workout, week to week, month to month, and year to year is the key.

    If you train to get your burn every week, but never add weight to the bar, the Gh isn't going to mean much, eh?
    Squats work better than supplements.
    "You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
    "You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
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  16. #16
    MA's Bionic Creation syntekz's Avatar
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    I agree, but I think if you train for the burn you could still increase the weight week to week/month to month.

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    WBBs motivational Speaker Rock's Avatar
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    So Arnold was right then, flexing in between sets to the muscle burns helps to build it. Man they knew alot of stuff 30-40 years ago.
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    Re: Muscle Burn

    Originally posted by Maki Riddington

    This would mean that the more of a muscle "burn" one gets the greater their chances are of stimulating the release of GH?
    This would ultimatley lead to more muscle mass.

    Your thoughts?
    which came fisrt the burn or the Gh release?While stimulting the body to produce extra Gh does it loose its efficiency to remove lactic acid as effectively?

    What exercise were used a pec deck burns like hell, while normal flat bench is not nearly as bad. So will a peck dec release more gh compared to bench (ignore the amount of muscle used?).
    my exprience - joined gym 10 years ago, 6 1/2 years hard weight training exprience.

  19. #19
    MA's Bionic Creation syntekz's Avatar
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    Too many variables to come up with a 'yes' or 'no' answer.

  20. #20
    Bigger fewl
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    Originally posted by Rock
    So Arnold was right then, flexing in between sets to the muscle burns helps to build it. Man they knew alot of stuff 30-40 years ago.
    LOL @ Arnold being right about something
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  21. #21
    Baby Seal Clubber ElPietro's Avatar
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    But I can cause a buildup of lactic acid on an exercise bike...does that mean that this is a suitable replacement for squats?
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  22. #22
    Bigger fewl
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    Originally posted by Paul Stagg
    The question to ask is:

    Is that increased Gh enough to make much, if any, of a difference?
    Squat...Eat...Sleep...Grow!

    Carpe diem

    Milk.... it does the body good.

  23. #23
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    Twice as much of very little is still very little... Avatar's first comment was spot on in my opinion. The "facts" you have presented from this study are very one sided as well. For example, do greater amounts of cortisol get released as well (with increased lactic acid)? In other words, in the body, there is usually not just one reaction or change at a time. So, this brings us back to Paul's and Avatar's points, train heavy, train hard, rest, eat sufficient calories, and try to progress with every intense session. Don't worry about the small stuff in every study (and there are tons and tons of studies as we all know).

  24. #24
    Growth Whoremone Short N Buff's Avatar
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    the burn from isometric flexing, i thought there was some inhibition after u flexed that much, so u can't flex hard anymore past a certain point. am i right or wrong? i kinda got this idea from a book i raed on flexibility but duno if it applies to strength.
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  25. #25
    Equal Opportunity Offender Budiak's Avatar
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    I no longer give any credence whatsoever to studies.
    I think its bunk.

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