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Thread: Guidelines To Gaining Muscle

  1. #1
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Guidelines To Gaining Muscle

    I'm sure this topic has come up numerous times but I would like to see what everyones method is to gaining muscle via food manipulation.

    Do you use a guidekine like a certain amount of carb, fat pro cals per pound of bodyweight?

    Do you take in a certain percentage of your carbs at a certain point in your day (postworkout)?

    Do you switch between protein and fat meals and carb and protein meals?

    Is your diet planned around one carbs, pro or fat?

    You get the idea......
    Maki Fit Blog

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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  2. #2
    Geordie The_Chicken_Daddy's Avatar
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    No. At least not currently, really. Usually i set myself an amount of protein to get in each day as minimum requirement, and carbs are counted. Fat i try to keep the amount 'adequate'. All calories are counted and considerated at all times though. With cutting and calorie reductions, this has changed somewhat.

    Carb for the day are split between 2-3 meal currently. All even portions whether it be post W/O or morning breakfast.

    Yes.

    Currently carb rotation but all macros are considered.
    "Geordie/'d3c:di/n. & adj. Brit colloq. n. 1 a native of Tyneside. 2 the dialect spoken on Tyneside. adj. of or relating to Tyneside, its people, or its dialect. [the name George + -IE]

  3. #3
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Ok, the reason being is I'm gonna start bulking again but I want to doit slowly so my BF doesn't skyrocket.

    I'm gonna be taking a pre workout shake and a post workout shake consisting of creatine, maltodextrin and whey protein.

    So most of my carbs will be consumed then.

    The rest of my meals will probally be protein and fat.
    My other carb meal will be breakfast.

    Thats what I have so far.......
    Thanks CD.
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  4. #4
    Geordie The_Chicken_Daddy's Avatar
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    yeah i plan to keep this methodology going on for my gaining phase.

    any reason for malto before and after? why not get some complex carbs for after, or complex prior and simple post?
    "Geordie/'d3c:di/n. & adj. Brit colloq. n. 1 a native of Tyneside. 2 the dialect spoken on Tyneside. adj. of or relating to Tyneside, its people, or its dialect. [the name George + -IE]

  5. #5
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    It's my understanding malto was fast acting?
    From what I've seen it may be more benificial to eat carbs and protein before a workout.
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  6. #6
    bone crusher
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    yea i'm curious about this as well. i know power thinks the hgh released during workout is not significant. That would be the only reason not to have carbs right?

    maki i think the malto is fast acting yes but more sustained than say using glucose

  7. #7
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Ya thats what I'm assuming Doc. Crabs+Insulin=good for you.
    I'm almost positive the GH effect will have little effect but ya have to look at all the hormones involved and find the right ratio to stimulate them all.
    Last edited by Maki Riddington; 01-28-2002 at 09:18 PM.
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  8. #8
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    I tried something like that last week and it went very well. The only problem was that by the end of the day my body was really craving carbs - i felt very tired.

  9. #9
    Always in the Action Severed Ties's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Maki
    Crabs+Insulin=good for you.
    hhhmmmm you should tell your girlfriend she can solve that problem by shaving,

    now Carbs+Insulin is indeed good for you.


    I'm almost positive the GH effect will have little effect
    Correct, the small exercise related hormone spikes are insignificant.
    "Your bench makes Jesus cry." -Shark

    This is 10% luck, 15% skill, 20% concentrated power of will, 5% pleasure and 50% pain, and 100% reason to remember the name...

  10. #10
    Geordie The_Chicken_Daddy's Avatar
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    this is a funny situation cause i've never heard of anyone using high GI for both pre and post train. Usually they use complex pre, simple post or vice versa.
    "Geordie/'d3c:di/n. & adj. Brit colloq. n. 1 a native of Tyneside. 2 the dialect spoken on Tyneside. adj. of or relating to Tyneside, its people, or its dialect. [the name George + -IE]

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    I eat pretty much balanced meals all thru the day. I don't understand eating only protein and fat, or eating complex carbs post training.

    I'll stick to the 4:1 simple carbs:whey post training, which has been time tested and proven to work by myself, others, and logic.

    (Sorry to step on your revolution, Chicken Daddy, LOL)

    Attempting to manipulate your hormones though diet is silly IMO. The tiny amount of Gh you'd get is nothing compared to taking a nap after you train, and getting extra sleep at night. While everyone is buisy reading these bs studies and theories on the net, I'll keep buisy growing.

    I like to shoot for around 40-60 carbs, 30-40 gm protein and 10-20 grams of fat per meal.

    I don't really count calories, but I'm aware that I'm eating enough. I only eat junk on weekends, and by keeping rest between sets minimal, I continue to get bigger and leaner.

    It all comes back to the eat sleep and train thing.

  12. #12
    Meathead Philosopher Pup's Avatar
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    I try and center my diet around protein and efas, when i'm not cutting, i'll usually eat all my carbs before 4pm. I'm playing around with some new things though, as i hate carbs, i might get the NHE book and try the bulk phase in their, the less carbs the better.
    May you be in heaven an hour before the devil knows you're dead.

  13. #13
    Always bad with diet
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    I work out at night and usually dont get home till around 10pm or later. I was told by a fitness trainer that while Im trying to lose bodyfat, dont eat any carbs after my workout due to the time of night it is. I was told to just chow my protein, my fat, and as far as carbs, some veggies, or a salad. Whatyda you guys think?

  14. #14
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
    this is a funny situation cause i've never heard of anyone using high GI for both pre and post train. Usually they use complex pre, simple post or vice versa.
    *** I'll try to find something for ya.
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  15. #15
    Geordie The_Chicken_Daddy's Avatar
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    mr_hand, ignore him. post train your body is more concerned with replenishing glycogen than storing fat.

    there's a bit more to it than this, such as how many carbs you've ate over the entire course of the day, the extent of the deminished glycogen reserves and the size of carbs you're gonna eat, but in general just make that carb meal after training your last active carb meal of the day. I'd also recommend low GI, complex carbs for this meal when trying to reduce bf.
    "Geordie/'d3c:di/n. & adj. Brit colloq. n. 1 a native of Tyneside. 2 the dialect spoken on Tyneside. adj. of or relating to Tyneside, its people, or its dialect. [the name George + -IE]

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    Always in the Action Severed Ties's Avatar
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    this is a funny situation cause i've never heard of anyone using high GI for both pre and post train. Usually they use complex pre, simple post or vice versa.
    High GI carbs preworkout, during your workout, and post workout is the absolute most optimal in terms of performance and recovery.

    ST
    "Your bench makes Jesus cry." -Shark

    This is 10% luck, 15% skill, 20% concentrated power of will, 5% pleasure and 50% pain, and 100% reason to remember the name...

  17. #17
    bien bueno! Marcel's Avatar
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    ST - check out my post on the supps. leptin level etc.
    "In the grand scheme of things, both things are quite superficial(obsessed with being muscular&ripped and incredibly strong). And yet lifting can teach you so much. My time at the gym--at least when I'm lifting--is invariably the high-point of my day. There aren't any questions; I almost don't even think. I go into an almost meditative trance-like state. Day-to-day worries become insignificant. I'm focused solely on the weight, and my reason for existence is clear. To move the bar and to improve on what I accomplished last time. Seldom are things so simple." - Blood&Iron

    "Most people cannot understand what burns in our blood, the gym is our addiction and iron is our drug. People don't understand why we commit hours a day to a goal where progress is so small it seems immeasurable, why we do cardio instead of watch TV, why eat 6 meals a day, why we insist on ordering diet soda or how we can drink skim milk. Most people will simply never grasp why we refuse to settle for a mediocre body." - Severed Ties

  18. #18
    Always in the Action Severed Ties's Avatar
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    Marcel

    I assume your referring to the thread "leptin and other question."

    I didn't read the thread to closely but I'd agree with most of the things PowerMan said in it.

    First off you absolutely can gain muscle and lose fat the same time and you don't need genetics to do it...yes it requires a well planned diet but it's this brainwashed 90's trend of low carb diets that just won't friggen die that has kept people from realizing this.

    I'm not gonna waste my time getting involed arguing. For bodybuilders. powerlifters, or any athlete CKD, NHE, TKD is crap. For the average person, well it's still not very good but at least is gets them on some kinda diet which is more important. I'm not average, nore are many of the people on this board so why would you use an average diet?

    ST
    "Your bench makes Jesus cry." -Shark

    This is 10% luck, 15% skill, 20% concentrated power of will, 5% pleasure and 50% pain, and 100% reason to remember the name...

  19. #19
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    You can't possibly think of posting "gain muscle and lose fat at the same time" without saying more. I mean come on, do tell. I think anyone who is reading this thread is dying to hear. Well at least I am because I definitely respect your opinion and know your not bullshitting.

    When is this article coming? Can't you give the basics?
    Last edited by aeckhardt; 01-29-2002 at 05:09 PM.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Avatar's Avatar
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    Originally posted by aeckhardt
    You can't possibly think of posting "gain muscle and lose fat at the same time" without saying more. I mean come on, do tell. I think anyone who is reading this thread is dying to hear. Well at least I am because I definitely respect your opinion and know your not bullshitting.

    When is this article coming? Can't you give the basics?
    I hope it doesn't take as long as the "anti-low carb" article.. hehe..
    "They will spend their nights dreaming of six-pack
    abs and a rock hard physique, little do they realize eventually we will reach
    our goal and they will be dreaming of the body we walk around with every
    day…only then will they understand." -- Severed Ties

    "There are 6 billion people in this world, and I'm #1." -- me

  21. #21
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    Haha. Palabra.

  22. #22
    bien bueno! Marcel's Avatar
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    ST - I don't want any average diet either! I thought NHE diet plan was gonna cut it but there's so mch frickin contradicting diets and ideas but I guess that's all part of the game. Anyways I appreciate that you are writing this article for all of us and I look forward to reading it.
    "In the grand scheme of things, both things are quite superficial(obsessed with being muscular&ripped and incredibly strong). And yet lifting can teach you so much. My time at the gym--at least when I'm lifting--is invariably the high-point of my day. There aren't any questions; I almost don't even think. I go into an almost meditative trance-like state. Day-to-day worries become insignificant. I'm focused solely on the weight, and my reason for existence is clear. To move the bar and to improve on what I accomplished last time. Seldom are things so simple." - Blood&Iron

    "Most people cannot understand what burns in our blood, the gym is our addiction and iron is our drug. People don't understand why we commit hours a day to a goal where progress is so small it seems immeasurable, why we do cardio instead of watch TV, why eat 6 meals a day, why we insist on ordering diet soda or how we can drink skim milk. Most people will simply never grasp why we refuse to settle for a mediocre body." - Severed Ties

  23. #23
    Always in the Action Severed Ties's Avatar
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    Marcel my article on low carb diets is mainly to open everyones eyes and get them to re-think how they approach dieting. I know Avatar is joking but I am actually rather annoyed that I haven't been able to finish it yet.

    At the current moment I'm trying to figure out if I can finance medical school and I have a series of x-rays and MRI's to go through this week for both my shoulders. So I'm only getting sparatic amounts of time to work on it.

    I am sorry I wet everyone's appetite and couldn't deliver sooner, but I think it will be well worth the wait.

    ST
    "Your bench makes Jesus cry." -Shark

    This is 10% luck, 15% skill, 20% concentrated power of will, 5% pleasure and 50% pain, and 100% reason to remember the name...

  24. #24
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    Yeah but I need it now, now damnit.

    "Daddy I want a golden goose, I want a golden gooes nooooowwww!!!!" - Willy the Wonkinater

    Just kidding although I really wish I knew what it was gonna say so that I could start optimizing my training now. Every day is a missed opportunity.
    Last edited by aeckhardt; 01-31-2002 at 03:00 PM.

  25. #25
    bien bueno! Marcel's Avatar
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    ST - no problem dude. I hope that the people that are telling you they need it now! etc. are joking because you are doing this to help us out and it's not like we are paying you.
    "In the grand scheme of things, both things are quite superficial(obsessed with being muscular&ripped and incredibly strong). And yet lifting can teach you so much. My time at the gym--at least when I'm lifting--is invariably the high-point of my day. There aren't any questions; I almost don't even think. I go into an almost meditative trance-like state. Day-to-day worries become insignificant. I'm focused solely on the weight, and my reason for existence is clear. To move the bar and to improve on what I accomplished last time. Seldom are things so simple." - Blood&Iron

    "Most people cannot understand what burns in our blood, the gym is our addiction and iron is our drug. People don't understand why we commit hours a day to a goal where progress is so small it seems immeasurable, why we do cardio instead of watch TV, why eat 6 meals a day, why we insist on ordering diet soda or how we can drink skim milk. Most people will simply never grasp why we refuse to settle for a mediocre body." - Severed Ties

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