The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #51
    Is cutting down to 9% Jordanbcool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holto
    The statement I objected to is you is equating aging with your body breaking down.

    My mom at 59, is currently leaner and stronger than when she was 18. She has been following my training and nutrition programs and has totally tranformed her body.

    She has accomplished all of this while fighting, Narcilepsy, Fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue syndrome.
    I know but like I said after a certain age...

    Look I had a great grandmother at 85 who was in top shape. But she still had other obvious problems with her body....brittle bones, bummed knee's etc. etc. She was pretty active but no one can outrun old age.

    And It would def. depend on the individual..
    Getting back in the groove
    "I'll tell you a secret. Something they don't teach you in your temple. The Gods envy us. They envy us because we're mortal, because any moment might be our last. Everything is more beautiful because we're doomed. You will never be lovelier than you are now. We will never be here again." - Achilles, (Troy 2004)
    Stats
    ATF squat- 275 RAW
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    Bench- Two 100lbs DB's four times
    190lbs 15% BF (Estimate)

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordanbcool
    no one can outrun old age.
    This is what you are dead wrong about.

    We can do alot to effect how we age.

    Built for example has several times the bone mass of most women her age.
    Last edited by Holto; 11-10-2006 at 03:59 PM.

    The Fitness Industry is a 1 billion dollar industry.
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  3. #53
    Is cutting down to 9% Jordanbcool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holto
    This is what you are dead wrong about.

    We can do alot to effect how we age.

    Built for example has several times the bone mass of most women her age.
    Holto. Your are arguing something that cannot be changed. You're using built as an example when she doesnt apply to this situation.

    Yea shes........mature (nice way of putting it lol) and in MUCH better shape then women her age but she wont/cant stay that way forever. Nobody can. She could be fit all her life but its a known fact that a persons body starts gradually deteriorating as time goes on. You can't beat time holto...Like I said, you can't compare women in mid life to women towards end life. You gotta get old one day.....Old as in, things just dont run the way they used to....

    I see your point though and its a good one. More people should take into consideration their health now for the future. Give me some time, I'll probably change my mind about certain things but right now I'm young and naive
    Last edited by Jordanbcool; 11-10-2006 at 04:17 PM.
    Getting back in the groove
    "I'll tell you a secret. Something they don't teach you in your temple. The Gods envy us. They envy us because we're mortal, because any moment might be our last. Everything is more beautiful because we're doomed. You will never be lovelier than you are now. We will never be here again." - Achilles, (Troy 2004)
    Stats
    ATF squat- 275 RAW
    Deadlift- 415
    Bench- Two 100lbs DB's four times
    190lbs 15% BF (Estimate)

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordanbcool
    Your are arguing something that cannot be changed.
    According to you it cannot be changed.

    Go to a village in a country where citizens don't have running water and see how many brittle old people you find.

    My friend mohammed's mother in Bangladesh would race her great grandchildren up ladders and win every time. She was 85.

    When Built is 85 she will not be as strong as she is now. Granted. She could EASILY be several times stronger than the average 25 year old.

    Injuries and disability are not mandatory. 70% of the strength that people lose as they age is neurological. This can be kept by simply using our bodies.
    Last edited by Holto; 11-10-2006 at 04:25 PM.

    The Fitness Industry is a 1 billion dollar industry.
    --Dairy Queens Blizzard pulls in 3/4 of a billion.
    --------------We are the elite.------------

  5. #55
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Not to mention the hormonal changes that occur as you get older. do you live with your mom, holto?

  6. #56
    C.S.C.S. ddegroff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordanbcool
    Holto. Your are arguing something that cannot be changed. You're using built as an example when she doesnt apply to this situation.

    Yea shes........mature (nice way of putting it lol) and in MUCH better shape then women her age but she wont/cant stay that way forever. Nobody can. She could be fit all her life but its a known fact that a persons body starts gradually deteriorating as time goes on. You can't beat time holto...Like I said, you can't compare women in mid life to women towards end life. You gotta get old one day.....Old as in, things just dont run the way they used to....
    You're right you can't beat getting older. BUT by eating healthy, lifting weights, and doing aerobic training you can lower your bodies age.
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  7. #57
    Is cutting down to 9% Jordanbcool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ddegroff
    You're right you can't beat getting older. BUT by eating healthy, lifting weights, and doing aerobic training you can lower your bodies age.
    Thats what my point was.

    I doubt you'll ever see a fit 120 year old.....but I agree that being physically healthy would have a huge impact.
    Last edited by Jordanbcool; 11-11-2006 at 02:23 PM.
    Getting back in the groove
    "I'll tell you a secret. Something they don't teach you in your temple. The Gods envy us. They envy us because we're mortal, because any moment might be our last. Everything is more beautiful because we're doomed. You will never be lovelier than you are now. We will never be here again." - Achilles, (Troy 2004)
    Stats
    ATF squat- 275 RAW
    Deadlift- 415
    Bench- Two 100lbs DB's four times
    190lbs 15% BF (Estimate)

  8. #58
    Senior Member Anthony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordanbcool
    I doubt you'll ever see a fit 120 year old.....
    My great-great-grandmother lived to be 109 years old and walked a mile every single day.

    Facebook - BW166 SQ585 BP405 DL660 CL310

  9. #59
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MixmasterNash
    Leg press is a bad exercise because it produces very high forces on the spine in a compromised position. Squats are much better in this respect.
    Yikes. Talk about black and white here.

    As I said squats are a better choice. The word "bad" is a term used to describe movements based on an individual's situation.

    From a bodybuilder's perscpective using the leg press to build the lower body is acceptable. I'd argue however that the same could be said for an athlete. This brings me back to my point of exercise selection being dependant on the individual's situation.

    As for using Defranco and his statement, I could quote a strength coach (Charles Poliquin) whos says that the leg press could very well be an effective means to building up the lower body for certain athletes. Bottom, line, everyone has a different view point. Sort of how I quoted Christian T to explain why training muscles is not a bad thing as opposed to training movement patterns. It depends on the person and who they have guiding them.

    People are so narrow minded sometimes. They read something and if it makes sense they adpat it and stick to it. Problem is, if they only train themselves it's kind of hard to step outside of their box to see the bigger picture.
    Last edited by Maki Riddington; 11-11-2006 at 03:49 PM.
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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  10. #60
    Go Heels! MixmasterNash's Avatar
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    No, I think they're bad, bad, bad, period.

    Fixed plane leg press machines are known for having the highest compressive forces on the lower back while it is in a weak, non-arched position.

    They're bad like upright rows -- they won't necessarily lead to injury, but even performed with correct form, they place the body in a situation with a higher potential for injury. And there are straightforward replacements that are actually better exercises for other reasons, e.g. high pulls and front/hack/belt squats.

    So, why bother with it?

    The journal / I live here.

    If I were to start from scratch as a young 13 year old again, I would do every press, squat, and perhaps deadlifts, for my entire career with chains. -- Dan John

  11. #61
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MixmasterNash

    Fixed plane leg press machines are known for having the highest compressive forces on the lower back while it is in a weak, non-arched position.
    What has lead you to hold such a strong opinion about the leg press being such a bad movement? You mention the words, "highest compressive forces" so I'm assuming there is some information that you've come across that has made you believe this.
    Maki Fit Blog

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    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  12. #62
    Go Heels! MixmasterNash's Avatar
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    Spinal compression during lumbar flexion, aka rounding of the lower back, is basically the worst possible situation for the spine, whether in a leg press, squat, or deadlift.

    Fixed track leg press machines require lumbar flexion for the user to even approach a full ROM, a huge amount of flexion at full ROM The only way to eliminate lumbar flexion is to stop when the knee joint is at a 90 degree angle, but this maximizes force on the knees. Also, leg press machines enable much greater weights than squatting, which further increases the potential for lumbar overloading.

    Again, the reason it is so "bad" is that there are easily available alternatives that do not suffer from these drawbacks; indeed, the alternatives usually involve functional movement patterns with minimal risk to the lumbar spine, because a correct arch can be maintained.

    The journal / I live here.

    If I were to start from scratch as a young 13 year old again, I would do every press, squat, and perhaps deadlifts, for my entire career with chains. -- Dan John

  13. #63
    Proud Father Maki Riddington's Avatar
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    Thank you.
    Maki Fit Blog

    At Large: Optimize Your Body | Dynamic Conditioning |
    My articles on Wannabebig

    "Soli Deo Gloria"
    "Test all things; hold fast what is good.": 1 Thessalonians 5:21

    "I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do--this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
    So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God's law; but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
    Romans 7:14-25

    "Judo is not about strength. Yet in the learning curve, all Judokas get strong. Only with time do you learn where to apply that strength."
    The Art of Judo

  14. #64
    Is cutting down to 9% Jordanbcool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony
    My great-great-grandmother lived to be 109 years old and walked a mile every single day.

    So.

    That doesnt mean that I will or that the majority of people at that age will be able to. I didnt want to say it because I didnt really care anymore but you can't really bring up one or two "I know this person....." when most people will never be that healthy/lucky at that late of an age. Like I said, my great grandmother was in shape and very fit at 85+ but still had problems with her knee's, eyesight, etc.
    Getting back in the groove
    "I'll tell you a secret. Something they don't teach you in your temple. The Gods envy us. They envy us because we're mortal, because any moment might be our last. Everything is more beautiful because we're doomed. You will never be lovelier than you are now. We will never be here again." - Achilles, (Troy 2004)
    Stats
    ATF squat- 275 RAW
    Deadlift- 415
    Bench- Two 100lbs DB's four times
    190lbs 15% BF (Estimate)

  15. #65
    Senior Member betastas's Avatar
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    A lot of people don't even live to 85 Jordan, because they treat themselves like crap or due to genetics. What they can do is remove lifestyle issues as the case for croaking early. Let me give you a personal example.

    My grandparents, on my fathers side.
    Grandma: Ate poorly, didn't exercise, smoked. Died of a heart attack before I was born.
    Grandpa: Ate well, exercised, was in the army til he was 65. Still alive, has had prostate cancer and is currently being treated still. He is in his mid-80s and still active. Reason? He never stopped being active.

    If you treat yourself well and exercise properly, you have a MUCH greater chance of living longer and having a higher quality of life. You can do questionable things while you're younger and potentially get away with it, but eventually it will catch up with you if you don't change your habits.

    I have no idea why you are discussing not being able to outrun old age. Of course you can't avoid becoming old and dying. However, there is excessive proof that treating yourself well will lessen the impact and increase your lifespan. Why would you merely wave your hand at 65 and say "Oh well, I'm old! I can now let myself fall apart!" ???
    Last edited by betastas; 11-13-2006 at 09:05 AM.

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maki Riddington
    People are so narrow minded sometimes. They read something and if it makes sense they adpat it and stick to it. Problem is, if they only train themselves it's kind of hard to step outside of their box to see the bigger picture.
    X80 billion... there are few people on this board who fit this description

  17. #67
    Is cutting down to 9% Jordanbcool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by betastas
    A lot of people don't even live to 85 Jordan, because they treat themselves like crap or due to genetics. What they can do is remove lifestyle issues as the case for croaking early. Let me give you a personal example.

    My grandparents, on my fathers side.
    Grandma: Ate poorly, didn't exercise, smoked. Died of a heart attack before I was born.
    Grandpa: Ate well, exercised, was in the army til he was 65. Still alive, has had prostate cancer and is currently being treated still. He is in his mid-80s and still active. Reason? He never stopped being active.

    If you treat yourself well and exercise properly, you have a MUCH greater chance of living longer and having a higher quality of life. You can do questionable things while you're younger and potentially get away with it, but eventually it will catch up with you if you don't change your habits.

    I have no idea why you are discussing not being able to outrun old age. Of course you can't avoid becoming old and dying. However, there is excessive proof that treating yourself well will lessen the impact and increase your lifespan. Why would you merely wave your hand at 65 and say "Oh well, I'm old! I can now let myself fall apart!" ???
    You have some great points.

    I dont think I'd let myself go. I just wouldnt care as much, you know? Like if I had to chose between eating a triple whooper at 68 or dump that and eat something much more healthy I'd pick the whooper. I would have already lived a meaningful life, my children would have grown and I would see my grandchildren. Other then that, I'd want to enjoy life as much as I possibly can. This would evidently lead to self defeating behaivors.....eating unhealthy foods, maybe smoking..etc. (however, again I wouldnt go out of my way to degrade my health)

    If I'm fortunate enough to live that long I would just count anything after that as "extra" time, basically to do whatever I wanted. It just wouldnt really bother me. If I could tack on 10-15 extra years by being healthy or die 15 years earlier and being extremly content then I'd pick the second option.

    Its more of an argument on personal veiws/purpose in life then it is health reasons.

    P.S. Most people are afraid of dying but I wouldnt want to "linger" around for an extra 20 years or so. Most of those people live their last years in a retirement home eating jello.....not something I'd like to be doing for the last days on this earth. Life is precious but so are expirences.
    Last edited by Jordanbcool; 11-13-2006 at 01:25 PM.
    Getting back in the groove
    "I'll tell you a secret. Something they don't teach you in your temple. The Gods envy us. They envy us because we're mortal, because any moment might be our last. Everything is more beautiful because we're doomed. You will never be lovelier than you are now. We will never be here again." - Achilles, (Troy 2004)
    Stats
    ATF squat- 275 RAW
    Deadlift- 415
    Bench- Two 100lbs DB's four times
    190lbs 15% BF (Estimate)

  18. #68
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    It's not only about adding years to your life, but life to your years.

    The Fitness Industry is a 1 billion dollar industry.
    --Dairy Queens Blizzard pulls in 3/4 of a billion.
    --------------We are the elite.------------

  19. #69
    Senior Member betastas's Avatar
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    Taking care of yourself even when you're in your 60s will lead to higher quality life. There isn't some inevitable moment when you suddenly become old and disheveled, weak, sick and unhappy. It's an accumulation of choices.

    If you take good care of yourself your whole life, barring genetic diseases or accidents, you will have a high quality life in your golden years, have more strength and mobility. You won't merely live til 90 (as an example), you will be able to actively participate in your grandkids lives, have good health and be comfortable, not wracked with illness and pain. Of all the seniors I meet, the ones who are the healthiest and live the best quality lives are very active and many exercise regularly.

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