The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Its no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    Am I overtrained?

    I was wondering if you guys could look over my routine and tell me if I am overtraining. I looked over all the symptoms for overtraining and I don't have any of them such as nausia, insomnia, increase in blood pressure, lack of motivation. I'm always on the lookout for any signs but they don't seem to be apparent. I kind of pride myself in working hard, I really don't have a problem with my routine I think its fun but I am concerned that perhaps I could be making better gains if I would cut back, the reason I am asking is because I have been told that this is excessive and I may not be making the gains I could be if I would cut back. Please put down your opinions and let me know.

    I have an ABC routine where I do workout A (say on Monday) workout B (say on Tuesday) on the C day (Wednesday) I rest then I begin the ABC again

    I began getting serious about lifting in June 2006. I did a three day a week routine of basic lifts for about a year prior to June 2006. Since I began lifting approximately June 2005 I have increased weight by at least 5-10 lbs a month on my bench, squat, military press, and deadlift.

    height 5'11
    Weight: 209
    Waist: 32
    Chest: 46
    Bicep: 16.5
    Neck: 16
    Calf: 15
    Thigh: 24
    Forearm: 13

    Workout A

    CHEST

    Incline Dumbbell Press (ea hand)
    5 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6, 6

    Flat Bench Press
    6 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6, 5, 4

    Decline Bench Press
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6

    Flat Dumbbell Flys
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    SHOULDERS

    Dumbbell presses (weight in each hand)
    6 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6, 5, 4
    Wide Grip Upright Rows
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6

    Bent Over Laterals
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Dumbbell Side Laterals
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    TRICEPS

    Triceps Parallel Bar Dips
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Pulley Pushdowns
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    One-Armed Dumbbell Extension (one arm at a time)
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Two Dumbbell Kickbacks
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-10

    Workout B[/SIZE]

    LEGS

    Squats
    6 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6, 5, 4

    Leg Extensions
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8
    Leg Curls
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8

    Stiff Legged Deadlifts
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8

    BACK

    Barbell Shrugs
    5 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-10

    Lat Pulldowns Behind Neck
    4 sets
    Goal amount of reps 6-8

    Barbell bent rows
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8

    Two armed dumbbell bent rows (ea hand)
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8

    BICEPS

    Dumbbell Preacher Curls (ea hand) 1
    5 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8
    Number of reps accomplished

    Incline Dumbbell Curls (ea hand)
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8

    Barbell Concentration Curls (hold at peak for 2)
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    FOREARMS

    Dumbbell Hammer Curls
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-10

    Barbell reverse curls
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-10

    Barbell Wrist Curls
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-10

    If this is excessive let me know what I should cut back on and why.

    Thanks

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  3. #2
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    oh my god YES YOU ARE OVERTRAINING

    How long do you spend in the gym on each workout? I would cut each workout literally in half.

  4. #3
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    3 hrs

    Thanks for the response, I'm currently doing 3 hours on my home equipment bench per work out day. That's surprising to me, I have been following Joe Weider's Ultimate Bodybuilding. I've been progressing through the suggested steps and this is the workout it says I should be on. I'm glad you brought this to my attention what would you suggest specifically I should cut back on. I want to make sure I'm doing enough but not too much.

  5. #4
    Wannabebig Member
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    You are doing way to much volume. You really only need to do 2 or 3 exercises for each body part. I usually spend about an hour doing my workout. With what your doing it must take you around 2 hours or more to finish. I would cut way back. I would imagine your gains would be alot better if you did.

  6. #5
    Senior Member beatlesfreak's Avatar
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    Squat, Bench, Deadlift.

    Do this and hit every muscle in your body hard in under 45 minutes. Then go eat some food and get some rest and grow.

    If you still have energy after a full-body workout do some pullups or rows or something, but don't waste daylight doing wrist curls. Your wrists will get plenty "curled" doing deads.

    3 hours in the gym is absurd without chemical assistance. Maybe you're young and able to do it. I'd be in a coma if I tried that routine for very long.

    Hit 'em hard then go home and let 'em rest.


  7. #6
    Senior Member pepsihatman's Avatar
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    You are training shoulders on the same day as chest? I would imagine this would lead to shoulder problems. I was once advised to never train shoulders the same day at chest. Apparently shoulders are used as a main stabilzer when you bench.

  8. #7
    Senior Member pinky8713's Avatar
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    It's fine to train shoulders on the same day as chest if you arn't doing 400 sets.

    Anyways, damn.. that is a lot of volume. And i wouldn't suggest working out for three hours a day. Try an hour.

  9. #8
    Senior Member shoot4dabigtime's Avatar
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    if you want to do the volume that you are currently during....break the split into a three day split, instead of your 2 day.

    EX: Workout A- Chest/Biceps
    Workout B- Back/Triceps
    Workout C-Legs/Shoulders

    This this is what i do! You can split it however you want, but only do two muscle groups a day.
    The Iron never lies to you. You can walk outside and listen to all kinds of talk, get told you're a god or a total bastard. The Iron will always kick you the real deal. The Iron is the great reference point, the all-knowing perspective giver. Always there like a beacon in the pitch black. I have found the Iron to be a good friend. It never freaks out on me, never runs. Friends may come and go. But two hundred pounds is always two hundred pounds.

  10. #9
    WannaBeBigger PGreezy's Avatar
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    Thats a crazy routine. I like to get in and out of the gym in an hour. I usually do 4 sets of 3 exercises for 2 body parts 3 days a week. Gotta love the Squats, Deads, and Bench Presses.
    Don't Cry Because Its Over; Smile Because It's Happened
    Shut Up and Do Some Deadlifts

    As of 11/13/06

    Age - 19
    Ht - 6'2''
    Weight - 260lbs x 1 (goal -20lbs)
    Bench - 260lbs x 1 (goal +40lbs)
    Squat - 550lbs x 1 (happy for now)
    Deadlift - 405 x 1 after 2 sets of 6 with 315 (goal +95lbs)
    Supplements - Whey Protein, Fish Oil, Multi-Vitamin.
    outnumber

  11. #10
    Newbie Galore
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    You could essentially cut this in half.

  12. #11
    Banned Tofer's Avatar
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    Wow, if you didn't instinctively know that your routine is overtraining, I shudder to think of what you would consider overtraining.

    I mean, Workout B has 60 sets. 60!! That's more than I do in an entire week!

  13. #12
    T.J.W. nhlfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ERIC13
    Joe Weider's Ultimate Bodybuilding
    ah.

    Quote Originally Posted by FuzzzyMan
    You could essentially cut this in half.
    he'd see gains on a fifth of the volume.
    -Matt
    gym lifts: squat: 341lbs, deadlift: 374lbs, bench: 275lbs
    My journal: http://www.wannabebigforums.com/showthread.php?t=85034
    "Fk you and the Prowler you rode in on"

  14. #13
    rampage don't squat bloodninja's Avatar
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    Holy crap is this routine some kind of a joke?

  15. #14
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    If you do Chest on A Shoulders on B and Triceps on C wouldnt I be overtraining my triceps?

  16. #15
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice

    Quote Originally Posted by shoot4dabigtime
    if you want to do the volume that you are currently during....break the split into a three day split, instead of your 2 day.

    EX: Workout A- Chest/Biceps
    Workout B- Back/Triceps
    Workout C-Legs/Shoulders

    This this is what i do! You can split it however you want, but only do two muscle groups a day.
    If you do Chest on A Shoulders on B and Triceps on C wouldnt I be overtraining my triceps?

  17. #16
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    You wouldn't necessarily be overtraining your tris because they aren't being directly hit everyday. It depends mostly on the person.

    Have a look at WBB1 for a good routine to start with. I would suggest using it for a few weeks. If you don't like it, at least use it as inspiration to redesign your current routine.
    Last edited by RedSpikeyThing; 11-09-2006 at 07:47 AM.

  18. #17
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    Workout A

    CHEST

    Incline Dumbbell Press (ea hand)
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6

    Flat Bench Press
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8

    Decline Bench Press
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8

    SHOULDERS

    Dumbbell presses (weight in each hand)
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6,

    Bent Over Laterals
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Dumbbell Side Laterals
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    TRICEPS

    Triceps Parallel Bar Dips
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Pulley Pushdowns
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12


    Workout B[/size]

    LEGS

    Squats
    5 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 12, 10, 8, 6, 5,

    Leg Extensions
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Leg Curls
    4 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    BACK

    Barbell Shrugs
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Lat Pulldowns Behind Neck
    3 sets
    Goal amount of reps 8-12

    Two armed dumbbell bent rows (ea hand)
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-8

    BICEPS

    Dumbbell Preacher Curls (ea hand) 1
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    Incline Dumbbell Curls (ea hand)
    2 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 8-12

    FOREARMS

    Barbell reverse curls
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-10

    Barbell Wrist Curls
    3 sets
    Goal amount of Reps 6-10

    This will effectively cut the routine in half does this look better?

  19. #18
    next-tyson-but-white arnoldsclone's Avatar
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    you are doing way too much on your arms. i admire the work ethic man, i lifted like that for my first 6-7 months to lose weight( 90lbs from '05 to '06), with a whole bunch of cardio as well. I would honestly do minimal work on the biceps, and focus on your tricep development. the most i would do for my chest workouts as far as sets for any given exercise is 4 sets minus legs, they can withstand more volume and benefit from it. If you thrash your muscles a little bit less on your workout you'll heal more fully and pack on more muscle. if you're pushing this hard because you've plateau'd then go to 4 by 4 on everything and seriously fail at 4 or 5 reps. i don't care what anyone says , you up weight seriously and you will grow.

    Ahnold says, " milk is for babies!"
    "deadlift if you know"- myself
    Boxing/ working out 5 days a week!
    6'1"- 230lbs-and bulking till i can't stand the mirror
    Former fatass- whent from 302lbs to 207 lbs rippling 05-06
    bench 315
    deadlift 455
    squat 405
    big 3 total = 1175 lbs of RAW IRON!!!MUAHAHAHAHAHA

  20. #19
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    My objective in training is not only to increase strength, stamina and bulk but to also hit the muscles at different angles when I work them to promote muscle separation and definition.

    For example I do incline presses for my upper pectorials, flat bench presses for my overall pectorials (or middle), decline bench presses for my lower pectorials.

    This is the reason for all the different workouts. My diet is really good I eat around 3000 calories per day around 200-250 grams of protein. I also take multivitamins, Amino Acids, B, D, and E vitamins along with creatine and other supplements to assist in recovery and stamina.

    I also looked into numerous articles from Muscle and Fitness and am now reading the New Encyclopedia of Modern BodyBuilding. They seem to all promote grueling training regiments with more than 5 sets per excercise. Arnold Schwarzenegger (the man) himself seems to promote 5 sets per excercise but then you have to take into consideration that a lot of people in the magazines and books including Arnold had used Anabolic Steroids so their recovery must be a lot faster than someone who is not on them. So you have to look at their routines and suggestions in that way and kind of come to your own conclusions on what would be best for you.

    Thats where I am right now, I'm taking the rest of the week off and starting again next Sunday on a new ABC program (two days on one day off) to hit each muscle group twice per a week. Please keep submitting your ideas and suggestions so I can work this out and begin fresh next Sunday.

    Oh and the 3 days on - one day off split sounds like a good suggestion, I'm definitly going to look into that as well

    Thanks for all your replys and suggestions this far

  21. #20
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    Plateau

    Quote Originally Posted by arnoldsclone
    you are doing way too much on your arms. i admire the work ethic man, i lifted like that for my first 6-7 months to lose weight( 90lbs from '05 to '06), with a whole bunch of cardio as well. I would honestly do minimal work on the biceps, and focus on your tricep development. the most i would do for my chest workouts as far as sets for any given exercise is 4 sets minus legs, they can withstand more volume and benefit from it. If you thrash your muscles a little bit less on your workout you'll heal more fully and pack on more muscle. if you're pushing this hard because you've plateau'd then go to 4 by 4 on everything and seriously fail at 4 or 5 reps. i don't care what anyone says , you up weight seriously and you will grow.
    Cool I'm glad you understand my work ethic, I like working hard when I workout because I want maximum results. Although I've read that you can only gain 1lb of muscle per week, any other amount of weight gained would be fat, I want to gain that pound of muscle without a doubt, and I'm willing to work as hard as it takes to get it.

    Yeah I'm primarily concerned with my arm size and development. I want some more muscle on my arms particularly my forearms and biceps. My triceps seem to be developing nicely I have a nice solid horseshoe apearance now when I flex, my chest, legs, shoulders, back all seem to be where they should be after 5 months of work, but my biceps and forearms are developing slowly and with much difficulty. This is frustrating. I'm thinking about possibly prioritizing my arms, does anyone have any ideas on this?

  22. #21
    C.S.C.S. ddegroff's Avatar
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    For example I do incline presses for my upper pectorials, flat bench presses for my overall pectorials (or middle), decline bench presses for my lower pectorials.
    no seperations, it's all the same muscle. You can't isolate one over the other.

    I also looked into numerous articles from Muscle and Fitness and am now reading the New Encyclopedia of Modern BodyBuilding.
    STOP NOW.

    Good for pictures bad for lifting routines. Read and search all you can on here.

    I also take multivitamins, Amino Acids, B, D, and E vitamins along with creatine and other supplements to assist in recovery and stamina.
    This seems all like over kill to me, especially with 200+ grams of protein per day. All you need is the multi, creatine, fish oil.

    They seem to all promote grueling training regiments with more than 5 sets per excercise. Arnold Schwarzenegger (the man) himself seems to promote 5 sets per excercise but then you have to take into consideration that a lot of people in the magazines and books including Arnold had used Anabolic Steroids so their recovery must be a lot faster than someone who is not on them. So you have to look at their routines and suggestions in that way and kind of come to your own conclusions on what would be best for you.
    FOLLOW your own conclusions, gear changes everything.
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    I've set it back - you might need to reboot, though..." -Built

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  23. #22
    Newbie Galore
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    After reading everything you've posted I'd suggest you start with a routine that has been proven and learn the principles behind them. Look for Bill Starr's 5x5 or Built's BGB. I'll be starting Built's BGB after this go around, but I can vouch for Bill's 5x5 program as putting in some 'hard work'.

  24. #23
    next-tyson-but-white arnoldsclone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ERIC13
    Cool I'm glad you understand my work ethic, I like working hard when I workout because I want maximum results. Although I've read that you can only gain 1lb of muscle per week, any other amount of weight gained would be fat, I want to gain that pound of muscle without a doubt, and I'm willing to work as hard as it takes to get it.

    Yeah I'm primarily concerned with my arm size and development. I want some more muscle on my arms particularly my forearms and biceps. My triceps seem to be developing nicely I have a nice solid horseshoe apearance now when I flex, my chest, legs, shoulders, back all seem to be where they should be after 5 months of work, but my biceps and forearms are developing slowly and with much difficulty. This is frustrating. I'm thinking about possibly prioritizing my arms, does anyone have any ideas on this?

    listen, you got it all wrong man, i used to think like you did, do 8 sets on my bi's because arnold says he did. all i did was lose tons of fat while preserving my muscle with all the stimulation. you want to get BIG right? Then you need to forget all the isolation movements and do compound lifts for a few months and then do isolation work for a month or less then go back to heavy lifts again. Your body grows better as a whole. your biceps and triceps will grow accordingly in proportion to your chest and back, not really easy to do the other way around. i thought their were ways to magically grow faster than most others, but it takes time, so relax, and think about every workout as putting money in the bank.

    Ahnold says, " milk is for babies!"
    "deadlift if you know"- myself
    Boxing/ working out 5 days a week!
    6'1"- 230lbs-and bulking till i can't stand the mirror
    Former fatass- whent from 302lbs to 207 lbs rippling 05-06
    bench 315
    deadlift 455
    squat 405
    big 3 total = 1175 lbs of RAW IRON!!!MUAHAHAHAHAHA

  25. #24
    no matter what SaVvY's Avatar
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    nobody can tell if your overtrained by a routine, it depends on how you feel - if you feel fine your ok

  26. #25
    Wannabebig Member ERIC13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaVvY
    nobody can tell if your overtrained by a routine, it depends on how you feel - if you feel fine your ok
    Yeah I feel fine with the regiment, like I said before I feel no soreness or fatigue (maybe a little stiffness the very next day) but I just want to make sure that I am getting the most I can out of training. If I am not making great gains from all this hard work than why waste the time. I give 100% intensity on every set so it is discouraging to hear that I may not only be regressing from overtraining this way but preventing from making the gains I could if I'd do less. I've heard a lot of opinions that say that my regiment may be overtraining, and if this regiment is having a negative effect on my body and preventing from progress perhaps cutting down will help, I'm willing to try to do that.

    For the previous person who mentioned Bill Starr 5x5, I'm looking into that thanks for the tip that regiment does look interesting I might try that.

    I'm giving my body the rest of the week to heal up from the possible overtraining I've been doing then beginning a new regiment next Sunday or Monday.

    Thanks for everybody putting down their opinions I'm reading over all of them and they all make a lot of sense, if anyone else has any other training regiments for people 5 months into their development in bodybuilding please put those links down, I'm looking all over the internet to solve this issue. I want to start on something new Sunday and stick with it for 3 months,

    Thanks

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