The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Senior Member Don Birnam's Avatar
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    Starting UD 2.0, Some Questions

    What role does/should cardio take in the UD 2.0? I want to start doing cardio for personal reasons and I feel it may complement the UD2. My activity levels are quite low, as my work is entirely on the computer. Using 15 calories per pound bodyweight, I should be eating 1725 cals on day 1/2. Should I eat more because of the cardio or should I just assume the cardio cancels out with my low activity level?

    McDonald lists a battery of supplements. How important is it to have all these supplements on the diet? Which ones are most important?

    For the depletion workouts McDonald says that you can do a full-body 2 hour depletion workout on Monday or split it across Monday and Tuesday. But on the "sample monday workout" it looks like a full-body workout on Monday and also on Tuesday (very similar though)... Is this just a typo?

    Thanks for all help and any other recommendations.

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  3. #2
    Banned Slim Schaedle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Birnam View Post
    What role does/should cardio take in the UD 2.0? I want to start doing cardio for personal reasons and I feel it may complement the UD2. My activity levels are quite low, as my work is entirely on the computer. Using 15 calories per pound bodyweight, I should be eating 1725 cals on day 1/2. Should I eat more because of the cardio or should I just assume the cardio cancels out with my low activity level?

    McDonald lists a battery of supplements. How important is it to have all these supplements on the diet? Which ones are most important?

    For the depletion workouts McDonald says that you can do a full-body 2 hour depletion workout on Monday or split it across Monday and Tuesday. But on the "sample monday workout" it looks like a full-body workout on Monday and also on Tuesday (very similar though)... Is this just a typo?

    Thanks for all help and any other recommendations.
    I've been using UD2 for almost 6 months (taking 2 weeks off every 6-8) mainly becuase it is actually pretty addicting for me, as crazy as that sounds.

    I started off not doing any organized cardio, except for walking about 15 minutes to and from my house and a summer class I was taking on campus.

    Once I cheated UC out of 80 bucks for a summer membership by signing up for enough classes to make me full-time and then dropping them before they started, I started walking on the treadmill for 30min to 1 hr. immediately after weight training on Mon and Tues, and also on Wed.

    This is pretty low intensity (3.5 mph, variable incline) and I feel it provided a physically noticeable benefit for exactly the reasons Lyle points out in the book.

    My cals are right at 1700, and I never changed them according to activity level. If I did take in account activity levels, my 50% of maintenance level would be ALOT higher than 1700. Since I was/have been doing fine, I just left it the way it is.

    Supplements:

    - Caffeine is 100% essential.
    - Ephedrine, or another appetite suppressant such as syphedrine is going to be your best friend too.
    - I pretty much did everything esle the way he says except for the glutamine and the drugs.
    - You might have to order Zinc orotate on the net. I couldn;t find it in any store.
    - Once you start getting noticeable results you could play around with the topical yohimbe he discussed (such as the AF Store's Yohimburn) to see if you think it provides any benefit (other than water loss)
    - I used creatine routinely each day, but I am now adopting the way he suggests and only using it from Thurs night to Sunday. (He never says it, but the goal is to depelete glycogen stores, so if one is using creatine to assist in substrate level phosphorylation of ADP, this would seem to slightly limit the usage of stored glycogen to provide ATP)
    - Dextrose for Thursday's carb up will be a good friend too.



    For Mon and Tues, I split it up. Chest, Back, Shoulders on Mon. Legs, Arms, Abs on Tues. It takes me about an hour and a half, most likely because I use a variety of exercises for each bodypart. He says you can do full body on Mon and Tues and just use lower volume each day. I have never done that and I am not going to try.

    Feel free to ask any other questions.
    Last edited by Slim Schaedle; 12-22-2006 at 09:39 AM.

  4. #3
    Senior Member Don Birnam's Avatar
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    Awesome advice, thanks slim.

  5. #4
    Wannabebig Member
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    Lyle really recommends Yohimburn? I may be very wrong, but every bone in my body just tells me that topical fat burners simply don't work. I've read that they only appear to work by tightening up the skin making it look like you've lost fat.

  6. #5
    Banned Roddy's Avatar
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    wtf is UD2?

  7. #6
    Banned Slim Schaedle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewTriathlete View Post
    Lyle really recommends Yohimburn? I may be very wrong, but every bone in my body just tells me that topical fat burners simply don't work. I've read that they only appear to work by tightening up the skin making it look like you've lost fat.
    He discusses the way in which topical yohimbe would work, as opposed to ingesting it and letting it build up in tissues.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roddy View Post
    wtf is UD2?
    Ultimate Diet 2.0

    from the book of the same name
    Last edited by Slim Schaedle; 12-24-2006 at 12:09 AM.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewTriathlete View Post
    Lyle really recommends Yohimburn? I may be very wrong, but every bone in my body just tells me that topical fat burners simply don't work. I've read that they only appear to work by tightening up the skin making it look like you've lost fat.
    topicals work. I have had good results with yohimburn ES, which is why I reccomend it.

    there is just no way to acheive the same concentration of yohimbine in fat tissue with oral dosing.

    transdermal delivery is pretty well established, otherwise the pharma's would not be using it.

    OT but really excited that they are making transdermal selegiline now.

  9. #8
    Banned Slim Schaedle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by korexite View Post
    OT but really excited that they are making transdermal selegiline now.
    too lazy to look it up right now, but what's that?

  10. #9
    Banned KingJustin's Avatar
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    Here was what I noted for myself for UD2 ... Adjust the calories as necessary. I'm 215-220 lbs, so take whatever percentage of that.

    Monday:
    Diet: Low Calories (~1600-1750), Low Carbs (50-87g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (210-325g), ~30-65g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    Workout: High rep, short rest periods; Chest/Back/Arms/Shoulders (DB Bench, T-Bar Rows, Military Press, Tricep Pushdowns, Curls) ... 3-5 sets x 12-15 reps, 1 minute rest in between
    Aerobic Cardio Optional

    Tuesday:
    Diet: Low Calories (~1600-1750), Low Carbs (50-87g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (210-325g), ~30-65g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    Workout: High rep, short rest periods; Legs/Abs/Traps (Hypers, Hack Squats, Abdominal Pulldowns, Pulley Shrugs) ... 4 sets x 12-15 reps
    Aerobic Cardio Optional

    Wednesday:
    Diet: Low Calories (~1600-1750), Low Carbs (50-87g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (210-325g), ~30-65g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    45-60 Minutes Cardio Optional

    Thursday:
    Morning Diet (~11:00 - 5:00) Low Calories (~1200), Low Carbs (~38g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (160-240g), ~22.5g-45g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    Evening Diet:
    Before Workout: 25-30g Carbs (Ideally Fruit), 15g Whey Before Workout, 5g Creatine, Caffeine
    Start with high GI liquid foods, switch to low GI foods
    In total, at night: About 2164.85 - 2500 calories at night (426-487g carbs, 73g protein, 19-29g fat)
    High GI Foods, a little low GI at night
    Workout: ~8:00 - Full Body High Intensity (Shrugs, Weighted Sit-Ups, Reverse Curls, Triceps, Incline DB, Sled, Romanian Deadlifts, Rows, Lat Pulldowns, Calf Raises) ... 1-3 sets x 6-10 reps, 1:30 - 2 minutes rest in between
    45-60 Minutes Cardio Morning

    Friday:
    Diet: High Calories (5300-6120), High Carbs (1044-1205g), Average Protein (177g), Low Fat (46-71g)
    Low GI Foods
    Supplements: Really focus on water, ~20g creatine throughout day, vinegar shots with each meal,
    No Workout

    Saturday:
    Diet: ~2700-3300 calories, Average Carbs (~400-500g Carbs), Average Protein (~180-215g), ~45-60g fat
    Low GI Foods
    Supplements: Caffeine pre-workout, Creatine post-workout
    Workout: Full body power workout (Chins, Squats, Bench, Deadlifts)

    Sunday:
    Diet: ~2700-3300 calories, Average Carbs (~400-500g Carbs), Average Protein (~180-215g), ~45-60g fat
    Low GI Foods
    Starchy Carbs during the day, Only vegetables at night
    Evening Workout: 45-60 Minutes Cardio

    Repeat
    Last edited by KingJustin; 01-25-2007 at 08:56 PM.

  11. #10
    Banned Slim Schaedle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingJustin View Post
    Here was what I noted for myself for UD2 ... Adjust the calories as necessary. I'm 215-220 lbs, so take whatever percentage of that.

    Monday:
    Diet: Low Calories (~1600-1750), Low Carbs (50-87g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (210-325g), ~30-65g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    Workout: High rep, short rest periods; Chest/Back/Arms/Shoulders (DB Bench, T-Bar Rows, Military Press, Tricep Pushdowns, Curls) ... 3-5 sets x 12-15 reps, 1 minute rest in between
    Aerobic Cardio Optional

    Tuesday:
    Diet: Low Calories (~1600-1750), Low Carbs (50-87g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (210-325g), ~30-65g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    Workout: High rep, short rest periods; Legs/Abs/Traps (Hypers, Hack Squats, Abdominal Pulldowns, Pulley Shrugs) ... 4 sets x 12-15 reps
    Aerobic Cardio Optional

    Wednesday:
    Diet: Low Calories (~1600-1750), Low Carbs (50-87g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (210-325g), ~30-65g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    45-60 Minutes Cardio Optional

    Thursday:
    Morning Diet (~11:00 - 5:00) Low Calories (~1200), Low Carbs (~38g, mainly vegetables), High Protein (160-240g), ~22.5g-45g Fat
    6g Fish Oil, Olive Oil or MCTs or DAG oil
    Add Calcium, Ephedrine/Caffeine, Centrum, Vitamin E, Zinc, Glutamine, Yohimbine before cardio
    Evening Diet:
    Before Workout: 25-30g Carbs (Ideally Fruit), 15g Whey Before Workout, 5g Creatine, Caffeine
    Start with high GI liquid foods, switch to low GI foods
    In total, at night: About 2164.85 - 2500 calories at night (426-487g carbs, 73g protein, 19-29g fat)
    High GI Foods, a little low GI at night
    Workout: ~8:00 - Full Body High Intensity (Shrugs, Weighted Sit-Ups, Reverse Curls, Triceps, Incline DB, Sled, Romanian Deadlifts, Rows, Lat Pulldowns, Calf Raises) ... 1-3 sets x 6-10 reps, 1:30 - 2 minutes rest in between
    45-60 Minutes Cardio Morning

    Friday:
    Diet: High Calories (5300-6120), High Carbs (1044-1205g), Average Protein (177g), Low Fat (46-71g)
    Low GI Foods
    Supplements: Really focus on water, ~20g creatine throughout day, vinegar shots with each meal,
    No Workout

    Saturday:
    Diet: ~2700-3300 calories, Average Carbs (~400-500g Carbs), Average Protein (~180-215g), ~45-60g fat
    Low GI Foods
    Supplements: Caffeine pre-workout, Creatine post-workout
    Workout: Full body power workout (Chins, Squats, Bench, Deadlifts)

    Sunday:
    Diet: ~2700-3300 calories, Average Carbs (~400-500g Carbs), Average Protein (~180-215g), ~45-60g fat
    Low GI Foods
    Starchy Carbs during the day, Only vegetables at night
    Evening Workout: 45-60 Minutes Cardio

    Repeat
    With the exception of Sunday, your diet numbers look practically identical to what mine did.


    Going with higher carb/lower fat on Sundays?
    Last edited by Slim Schaedle; 01-25-2007 at 09:39 PM.

  12. #11
    C.S.C.S. ddegroff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Schaedle View Post
    I've been using UD2 for almost 6 months (taking 2 weeks off every 6-8) mainly becuase it is actually pretty addicting for me, as crazy as that sounds.

    I started off not doing any organized cardio, except for walking about 15 minutes to and from my house and a summer class I was taking on campus.

    Once I cheated UC out of 80 bucks for a summer membership by signing up for enough classes to make me full-time and then dropping them before they started, I started walking on the treadmill for 30min to 1 hr. immediately after weight training on Mon and Tues, and also on Wed.

    This is pretty low intensity (3.5 mph, variable incline) and I feel it provided a physically noticeable benefit for exactly the reasons Lyle points out in the book.

    My cals are right at 1700, and I never changed them according to activity level. If I did take in account activity levels, my 50% of maintenance level would be ALOT higher than 1700. Since I was/have been doing fine, I just left it the way it is.

    Supplements:

    - Caffeine is 100% essential.
    - Ephedrine, or another appetite suppressant such as syphedrine is going to be your best friend too.
    - I pretty much did everything esle the way he says except for the glutamine and the drugs.
    - You might have to order Zinc orotate on the net. I couldn;t find it in any store.
    - Once you start getting noticeable results you could play around with the topical yohimbe he discussed (such as the AF Store's Yohimburn) to see if you think it provides any benefit (other than water loss)
    - I used creatine routinely each day, but I am now adopting the way he suggests and only using it from Thurs night to Sunday. (He never says it, but the goal is to depelete glycogen stores, so if one is using creatine to assist in substrate level phosphorylation of ADP, this would seem to slightly limit the usage of stored glycogen to provide ATP)
    - Dextrose for Thursday's carb up will be a good friend too.
    I agree on all of this.

    When I did it this summer I took a quasi aerobics class for credit. It was two hours M/W. It was brutal on low cals but I think it really helped.

    For the workouts, I did the same workout two days in a row. I would do chest 6x15, back 6x15, legs 6x15, shoulders 6x15. Then I would just do the major muscles the next day again. It worked well for me.

    Only supplement I would add is Nitrean. It fills you up and it has all the best proteins.
    Make Shift IF diet
    My Training Experience
    GET BODY SMART
    Goals:
    CF WOD and Recomp...
    "My fault. I was fiddling with the Gravitational Constant of the Universe again.
    I've set it back - you might need to reboot, though..." -Built

    "Nothing can stop the man with the right mental attitude from achieving his goal--
    nothing on earth can help the man with the wrong attitude" - Thomas J

    "Obsessed is what the lazy call the dedicated" - Slim Schaedle

  13. #12
    Iced Earth - Stormrider ArchAngel777's Avatar
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    I did UD 2.0 for three weeks and was going on my fourth when I injured by hand pretty bad. Anyhow, I think it works great. I did get noticably leaner...

    You can find out a wealth of information on his message boards. Such as lowing calories further if you want. Some people PSMF (800 cals, 90% protein for me) Mon - Thur and then carb up.

    My first carb up I couldn't believe all the food I had to eat... My second carb up I wanted to eat more! My third... Well, right at the finish of the 3rd week I injured my hand, was depressed and ate like sh!it for two days AFTER my carb load. I was bloated as heck, but it only took 2 days of PSMF to bring me back down to my origional composition. So, anyhow, I am currently in my 4th cycle of it, but am doing the two week cycle due to injury.

    My biggest dislike with the whole diet? Carb loads... I must be one of the few people who are extremely sensitive to them. For instance, someone said you couldn't overeat with oatmeal... Totally wrong. I ate 10 servings of plain oatmeal (with some splenda on top) and was still hungry. So, that day I ate about 7 -8 servings for lunch, and another 7 - 8 servings for dinner. I tell you, that chit cannot fill me up for anything. French Toast, I tried that... Hell, I had 15 pieces and was still hungry. Carbs do nothing to satiate me and created a eating monster. So, in that regard, I abhor the carb loads because I lose control, which IMO, isn't a matter of a weak will, but of something going on with the appitite. For my next carb load, I will probably do sugar free Pudding + Fat Free cool whip over a two day period for my entire carb load. It is one of the few carbs that can keep my satiated and in control. Bagels work, but only when protein is mixed with them.

    Edit **
    *The only thing I take is is 1 - 2 multi-vitamins during my 4 day depletion.
    *Did cardio 2 - 3 times a week, low intensity (65% HR) for 45 minutes, this
    is in addition to the four weighted workouts in the book.
    *I mixed up depletion exercised quite often. I would do Squats, Leg Press, Leg Extensions, Leg Curls, Running to deplete legs. Upperbody would be BP, IBP, Machine BP, MP, Pullups, pulldowns of all different grips, rows of different grips, etc...
    Last edited by ArchAngel777; 01-26-2007 at 08:15 AM.

  14. #13
    Senior Member Vapour Trails's Avatar
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    I never did any cardio and results were good. 195 to 186 in 32 days (4x8 day cycles).

    Arch, I'm not getting something here...splenda and sugar free pudding whilst carb loading? I generally had to force feed during carb loads.

    Just a note on depletions......12-15 reps generally does not achieve the right TUT. The sets should last 30-45 secs, which was about 20 reps with a medium pace for me. In any case, when the burning is nearly unbearable, you are done your set. I always used 2 fullbody workouts on consecutive days.
    Last edited by Vapour Trails; 01-30-2007 at 12:13 PM.
    That's a picture of Scarlett Johansson.

  15. #14
    Iced Earth - Stormrider ArchAngel777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapour Trails View Post
    I never did any cardio and results were good. 195 to 186 in 32 days (4x8 day cycles).

    Arch, I'm not getting something here...splenda and sugar free pudding whilst carb loading? I generally had to force feed during carb loads.

    Just a note on depletions......12-15 reps generally does not achieve the right TUT. The sets should last 30-45 secs, which was about 20 reps with a medium pace for me. In any case, when the burning is nearly unbearable, you are done your set. I always used 2 fullbody workouts on consecutive days.
    Splenda is an additive on my oatmeal. Why? Because I want to avoid sucrose intake. Splenda has maltodextrin added to it and therefore, even the small ammount of calories it does have are good ones (for carb loads). So the focus on the carbs is my oatmeal and in order to make it taste optimal, you need some sort of sweetener. So, I add splenda. That is why I use splenda and not table sugar (I don't want to waste my very small dose of fructose that I am allotted)

    As far as sugar free pudding. Same thing here... I don't want sugar because it contains fructose. Even sugar free pudding containts a good emount of maltodextrin (30g a box, aprox). So, I generally use several boxes with less milk that it calls for (1/2) and generally turn it into a thick pie filling. At that point, I add fat free whip cream on it and enjoy. Essentially, it is a treat that is quite filling.

    On my first carb load I had to force feed the food as well, but after that I become an insatiable monster. Now I wish carb loads had MORE calories.

    As far as depletion goes. For me, personally, 10 reps is around 60 seconds of time under tension. I do them slow and controlled. I pretty much always get 60+ seconds of tension for each set. Yes, it burns and feels like fire sometimes. I also make sure to give myself no more than 1 minute between sets, generally is 45 seconds.
    Last edited by ArchAngel777; 02-02-2007 at 10:44 AM.

  16. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Schaedle View Post
    too lazy to look it up right now, but what's that?
    its an maoi-b.

    increases dopamine by inhibiting its breakdown

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