The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1601
    Go Bears Pete22's Avatar
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    Hmmm... Ghetto Belt Squats, I may have to give those a try. I have a dip belt laying around that I never use. Good work.
    My Training Log

    You want science and studies? **** you. I've got scars and blood and vomit. - Jim Wendler

  2. #1602
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete22 View Post
    Hmmm... Ghetto Belt Squats, I may have to give those a try. I have a dip belt laying around that I never use. Good work.
    they were okay. quite hard to be honest, due to stability issues. you can't sit back into the squat like you can do on a real belt squat machine. did them in place of ukranian DL's, probably will just stick to those next time.
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  3. #1603
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    DE bench

    *dynamic warmup, 50 mini band pushdowns*

    speed bench w/doubled minis, various grips:
    95 x 6 x 3

    tate presses:
    30's x 10
    40's x 10
    50's x 10

    overhead rope extensions:
    50 x 10
    60 x 10
    70 x 10

    vertical chest supported one arm sideways rows...? scratch that,

    Bell rows:
    70 x 10
    90 x 10
    115 x 10

    lateral raises:
    25's x 2 x 10 each arm
    30's x 2 x 10 each arm

    rear delt raises:
    25's x 10
    35's x 10

    pec dec:
    120 x 10
    135 x 10
    160 x 10

    20 min bike


    benching all felt fast, but the tate presses didn't feel too good on the elbows. not sure if its a weakness or what, but i'm going back to icing them after each bench session. i'm sitting here with one of my old inzer 2 meter knee wraps holding an ice pack on my elbow. familiar feeling!
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  4. #1604
    Getting Better..... bigmoney's Avatar
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    nice benchin sir! Ice them 'bows!

  5. #1605
    Body by 4th Meal Big o Boy's Avatar
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    lones I find if I bring the Tate presses in to close I get the same elbow pain. I started doing them with heavier weights on an incline (to shorten ROM) and bringing the end of the dbs down on the shoulders. That's seemed to work better for me.
    Weight: 194.0 lbs.Height: 5' 11"
    Raw PR's 425/340/534
    Goals for '10:
    Put on size and git Strong(er)
    Raw Goals: 450 Squat, 365 Bench, 570 Deadlift

    "Weak points come from not doing the things you suck at doing." -Dave Tate

  6. #1606
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    Well you don't want to shorten the range of motion too much otherwise they lose a good bit of their benefit.

    But I do think you might be going just a little bit heavy on them. I'd keep it in the 35-40lb db range for awhile. When I first started Lou wouldn't let me use anything heavier than the 30s because it takes those tendons a long time to slowly grow, but a short time to get screwed up. So I think if you drop the weight a little you'll be set.

    I'd also think it'd be a good idea to to 2 rep out sets with straight weight or DB's. Two sets of 15-25 would be the best.


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  7. #1607
    Senior Member FFHill's Avatar
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    Elbow pain sucks man. I see you have officially given Travis his very own movement. Boy's moving up in the world! LOL

  8. #1608
    Body by 4th Meal Big o Boy's Avatar
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    Thanks for the tip, Travis. I may try lowering the weight and doing them with higher reps to build up the tendons with the longer range of motion.
    Weight: 194.0 lbs.Height: 5' 11"
    Raw PR's 425/340/534
    Goals for '10:
    Put on size and git Strong(er)
    Raw Goals: 450 Squat, 365 Bench, 570 Deadlift

    "Weak points come from not doing the things you suck at doing." -Dave Tate

  9. #1609
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    Well you don't want to shorten the range of motion too much otherwise they lose a good bit of their benefit.

    But I do think you might be going just a little bit heavy on them. I'd keep it in the 35-40lb db range for awhile. When I first started Lou wouldn't let me use anything heavier than the 30s because it takes those tendons a long time to slowly grow, but a short time to get screwed up. So I think if you drop the weight a little you'll be set.

    I'd also think it'd be a good idea to to 2 rep out sets with straight weight or DB's. Two sets of 15-25 would be the best.
    thanks for the advice, thats probably a good idea. my triceps are fairly strong on most exercises, but tate presses absolutely smoke them. means i should probably do them more.

    i used to do repouts after DE bench, don't know why i stopped. i will start back doing some repouts after my speed benching.

    advice is appreciated as always. i try to lay off the ibuproufen as much as possible, but i will probably end up taking some tonight after dinner.
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  10. #1610
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    Well you don't want to shorten the range of motion too much otherwise they lose a good bit of their benefit.

    But I do think you might be going just a little bit heavy on them. I'd keep it in the 35-40lb db range for awhile. When I first started Lou wouldn't let me use anything heavier than the 30s because it takes those tendons a long time to slowly grow, but a short time to get screwed up. So I think if you drop the weight a little you'll be set.

    I'd also think it'd be a good idea to to 2 rep out sets with straight weight or DB's. Two sets of 15-25 would be the best.
    one more thing, Travis...

    on a video of you doing tates awhile back, you seemed to tuck your elbows a bit...should i be doing this to take some of the stress off the shoulder and elbow?
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  11. #1611
    Getting stronger Donnajo's Avatar
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    So, I guess vicki and I will be doing Tate presses this way too. I like this trickle down affect. We benefit from all this knowledge.

  12. #1612
    Who me? Chubrock's Avatar
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    How do you like the Tate presses?

    Fuck, fight, or hold the light.

  13. #1613
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonesXedge View Post
    one more thing, Travis...

    on a video of you doing tates awhile back, you seemed to tuck your elbows a bit...should i be doing this to take some of the stress off the shoulder and elbow?
    Go ahead and try it. If it feels more natural, stick with it, otherwise just keep doing it the way you normally do them.

    Even though your tri's are naturally strong, keep in mind you're trying to do tate presses with weights that 400lb raw benchers use. You have to be ultra careful when you are doing exercises that focus on the extensors themselves.

    Don't be afraid of the ibuprofen, its better to use it than end up injured. If you find yourself having to take it pre workout though, thats a no no just because it limits your body's ability to tell you when to stop.

    Keep up the good work bud!


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  14. #1614
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chubrock View Post
    How do you like the Tate presses?
    i've done them a few times in the past, and i like them pretty well. they were just bothering my elbow and tendon yesterday. i don't think my triceps are used to this much work, plus the fact that i was using too much weight, equals hurting elbows.
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  15. #1615
    Always listening & learnin lil' power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    When I first started Lou wouldn't let me use anything heavier than the 30s because it takes those tendons a long time to slowly grow, but a short time to get screwed up. So I think if you drop the weight a little you'll be set.

    I'd also think it'd be a good idea to to 2 rep out sets with straight weight or DB's. Two sets of 15-25 would be the best.
    Ah hah, Lones this makes my elbow feel better already!!! I'll drop the 35's down to 25's next time and rep them out.
    Last edited by lil' power; 11-06-2008 at 07:30 AM.

  16. #1616
    Senior Member FFHill's Avatar
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    how's the elbows today?

  17. #1617
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lil' power View Post
    Ah hah, Lones this makes my elbow feel better already!!! I'll drop the 35's down to 25's next time and rep them out.
    Whoops, I should have clarified. The two sets of 15-25 should be DB flat bench.

    I switched topics there without clarifying LOL. Definately drop the weight on the Tates though but I think reps around 10-12 would be fine


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  18. #1618
    Always listening & learnin lil' power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    Whoops, I should have clarified. The two sets of 15-25 should be DB flat bench.

    I switched topics there without clarifying LOL. Definately drop the weight on the Tates though but I think reps around 10-12 would be fine
    okay...gotcha...

    ? Travis...what do you think of incline DB presses for a raw bencher...you are invited to stop by and comment on my journal also...maybe some differences due to Lones is going w/gear and for now I'm competing raw. Thanks...sorry for the hijack Lones...

  19. #1619
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    Incline DB's are great for raw benchers! Reason being that many raw benchers use their shoulders a lot and inclines are a good way to hit your shoulders without doing tons of damage. I'd throw them in maybe every other week maybe as an ascessory exercise. I'll be sure to stop by your log though


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  20. #1620
    Getting stronger Donnajo's Avatar
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    Um, my lats are very sore from those bell rows today and so are my triceps from the tate presses and OH extensions.

    Heavy pulling tonight should be interesting. Maybe we should not try new things the day before a max pull. LOL
    Last edited by Donnajo; 11-06-2008 at 11:07 AM.

  21. #1621
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donnajo View Post
    Um, my lats are very sore from those bell rows today and so are my triceps from the tate presses and OH extensions.

    Heavy pulling tonight should be interesting. Maybe we should not try new things the day before a max pull. LOL
    see my post in Vik's log
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  22. #1622
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    you know the fact that you guys are both raw lifters is something i probably don't take in consideration as much as i should. i learn from all geared lifters. i am training the s*** outta my lockout for the shirt, and the s*** out of my posterior chain for squatting with gear. quad work would be good for both of you guys, also, if i was training for a raw bench, i would do more shoulder work like Travis said. for my squat and deadlift i am doing what works for me (seems to be working for you both as well), and for bench, well, i am basically doing whatever Travis says to do.

    i know the standard westside template will yield great results for you guys, because i had great results with it when i trained raw, but if i was training raw i would decrease the volume a bit (to avoid overtraining), and add in more shoulder and quad work. also i know both of you are eating either at maintenence or below maintenence calories, and that is something you need to be careful with. i have found its much easier to overtrain when eating at those amounts. let me know what you think, we can talk more about it at the gym tonight.
    Last edited by Lones Green; 11-06-2008 at 01:32 PM.
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  23. #1623
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    ME squat/dl

    *dynamic warmup, hip stretching, light pulldowns*

    Deadlifts:
    135 x 5 (conv)
    225 x 5 (conv)
    275 x 3 (conv)
    315 x 3 (sumo, add viking briefs + king sumo suit straps down & belt)
    365 x 1
    425 x 1
    475 x 1 (loose straps up)
    515 x 0 (loose straps up)
    515 x 1 (straps cranked)

    GHR's:
    BW x 10
    purple band around neck x 10
    green band around neck x 10

    pull throughs w/blue band, 3 x 10

    hangman abs, blue, 3 x 10


    missed the last 515 at lockout. for awhile now i have been pulling heavy every 3-5 weeks and have made a PR every time, but not today. i pulled 515 at my last meet in my pro squatter with loose ass straps. my gains are slowing down a bit, that just means i need to work that much harder. i was wearing an assload of gear for the deads, had to duct tape my briefs down to get my suit over it. in fact, it could have been TOO much gear. next time i will try pulling for a heavy single in the king suit only, then i will back off the gear for deads and work on them raw and in briefs only. we are also talking about getting some chains as well, so i will be able to work the lockout of the deadlift more, because its quite hard with the equipment i have access to now. most of my lockout work comes from my DB rows, which have been consistently going up, which makes me think i just plain need some more deadlift lockout work, and more posterior chain work. good news is my grip was fine.

    i got a couple videos, i will post them up this weekend. overall a solid workout. 15 weeks out from my next meet this saturday, so i will back off a bit before my next training cycle (except i will bench shirted, because i need as much time as i can get in that thing.)

    i will work on a 12 week training cycle for this meet for squat and deadlift, but i'm going to need some help (cough TRAVIS cough) setting up my bench training. hell, my shirt might not even be here until 12 weeks out.

    if anyone has any questions or is unclear from the above passage about the story of my life, please don't hesitate to ask. LOL.
    23 years old
    6'3, 308 lbs

    825 Squat
    470 Bench
    645 Deadlift
    1905 total
    www.atlargenutrition.com

  24. #1624
    Getting stronger Donnajo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonesXedge View Post
    you know the fact that you guys are both raw lifters is something i probably don't take in consideration as much as i should. i learn from all geared lifters. i am training the s*** outta my lockout for the shirt, and the s*** out of my posterior chain for squatting with gear. quad work would be good for both of you guys, also, if i was training for a raw bench, i would do more shoulder work like Travis said. for my squat and deadlift i am doing what works for me (seems to be working for you both as well), and for bench, well, i am basically doing whatever Travis says to do.

    i know the standard westside template will yield great results for you guys, because i had great results with it when i trained raw, but if i was training raw i would decrease the volume a bit (to avoid overtraining), and add in more shoulder and quad work. also i know both of you are eating either at maintenence or below maintenence calories, and that is something you need to be careful with. i have found its much easier to overtrain when eating at those amounts. let me know what you think, we can talk more about it at the gym tonight.
    I think that everything you are doing for us is awesome. You brought my squat up from a 185 to 245 in a matter of 3 months. My dead went from 250 to 300. My bench well that is another story. I really do appreciate you taking me under your wing and helping me. I never would be as far as I am without your help. I know it must drive you nuts sometimes working out with two girls. LOL

    But I do agree that maybe I should add in here in there some specific stuff for my issues. Like what travis was suggesting for Vicki as a raw bencher to incline press and shoulder and quad work. I could just throw that in there.

    To be honost my issue is stress in my life that can't be helped right now that is affecting my sleep and lack of appetite. But I am dealing with it and pushing through. I do want to eat more and get stronger and am trying to choke down more food.


    Oh, and great job deadlifting in the gym today. You are amazing strong.
    Last edited by Donnajo; 11-06-2008 at 07:41 PM.

  25. #1625
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donnajo View Post
    To be honost my issue is stress in my life that can't be helped right now that is affecting my sleep and lack of appetite. But I am dealing with it and pushing through. I do want to eat more and get stronger and am trying to choke down more food.

    Stress does have a really large effect on your recovery. Cortisol levels are boosted and that really inhibits muscle recovery.

    Deal with it first. Then get strong. Trying to push harder when you're stressed out just burns out the candle at both ends.

    Just my 2 cents though. At the end of the day you'll know what's best I'm sure


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