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Thread: Variation in Bench Press Study

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howard 9 View Post
    . But am i gonna believe something that contadicts what I have experienced?


    Well, that's what you're asking us to do.
    Last edited by Songsangnim; 06-26-2007 at 01:40 AM.

  2. #52
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Not to be a dick, bud, but how much experience can a 6 foot, 190 pound guy with one year of lifting experience HAVE?
    "Except Belial. He knows everything. This isn't a sarcastic attack, either. He really knows everything." -----Organichu
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  3. #53
    202 CarlP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMcGuire View Post
    LOL

    So would it also be weird to do the pec dance to the cashier when youre getting your order taken at McDonalds?

    Whatever makes you happy.

  4. #54
    Senior Member Natetaco's Avatar
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    well after all this information has been posted, im hoping we wont see another thread on this.

    ha maybe in a week.
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  5. #55
    Senior Member Howard 9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belial View Post
    Not to be a dick, bud, but how much experience can a 6 foot, 190 pound guy with one year of lifting experience HAVE?
    not a lot, but i can see what works and what doesn't. And yes you were trying to be a dick, but thats ok.
    Last edited by Howard 9; 06-26-2007 at 11:37 AM.
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  6. #56
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howard 9 View Post
    not a lot, but i can see what works and what doesn't. And yes you were trying to be a dick, but thats ok.
    No he wasnt. He was being honest is all man. I doubt youve seen substantial growth in your "upper" pecs from your incline work...

    Maximal development takes place with the basic benchpress - end of story.

    What else develops is from nutrition and genetics.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

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    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  7. #57
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    ^^

    I've also seen a more productive growth in my "upper pectorial" region, from incorporating the incline bench press..

    I've been lifting for four years to settle any dispute about me having enough time to see or anything of the sort lol...

  8. #58
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    Also, what movements make the definition in your arm-pit area more pronounced? Because my lower pecs lack a "bulky" look while my upper pecs and inner arms dont...

    See pic for refrance...
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #59
    Senior Member dblockspky's Avatar
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    I took out a book from the library a while on exercise physiology but I also looked at the book next to the one that I took out and it had a documented experiment inside about how some guy made one of the subjects move their arm a certain way in the upward direction and with a stick in the middle of the subjects pectoral it showed what "appeared" to be the upper portion of the chest contracting. Sooo.. I dunno.

    No it isn't possible to isolate the upper or lower portion of the chest, the whole chest will always move as a whole. But, i think it would definitely be possible to "emphasize" a certain part of the chest. I think everybody knows from personal experience that you can feel it in different areas of the chest whether you want to be ignorant to that fact or not.

    Buttt to this day I haven't seen a picture of a guy that has only an "upper chest" or a huge "lower chest" so maybe you can't even really emphasize it and it doesn't matter what type of feelings you get in your chest.

    The argument is quite repetitive though, and really never does get solved. I think a lot of people don't like to accept what those that tell them that you can't isolate different areas of the chest because for 1) they can feel themselves that only certain areas of the chest feel fatigued after doing specific lifts and 2) when you're getting told by some random guy on the internet that claims that studies are false that makes it even harder to believe.
    Last edited by dblockspky; 06-27-2007 at 07:04 PM.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belial View Post
    Maybe they just find it odd that you're going up to people on the street talking about your pecs.
    huh....when did I ever say I went up to people and talked about my pecs?

  11. #61
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dblockspky View Post
    I took out a book from the library a while on exercise physiology but I also looked at the book next to the one that I took out and it had a documented experiment inside about how some guy made one of the subjects move their arm a certain way in the upward direction and with a stick in the middle of the subjects pectoral it showed what "appeared" to be the upper portion of the chest contracting. Sooo.. I dunno.
    Hey mate, re-read. My point was that low-level activation does not imply stress leading to hypertrophy. I don't think anybody here is "choosing to be ignorant". Well, certainly not on the "no isolation" side of the argument.

    Howard9- After a year, ANY growth will seem remarkable. After a year of lifting I thought I knew what worked too. After three years of lifting, I realized I didn't know jack ****. I'm slowly learning, though, and have come to finally understand jack ****. Eventually I will master jack ****, then I will go on to teach it. Then, once I've taught it for a while, I may actually learn something useful. Only then will I use my experience as an example to illustrate my points.

    And, STATUS, at your size, regardless of years spent lifting, I doubt your pecs are large enough to be any sort of example. You're still quite small, so your point doesn't hold much water.


    Why am I picking on you guys for your size and experience? I'm not trying to be discouraging, or trying to be an *******. I could be an ******* if I wanted to. I'm actually really good at it. Just ask my mother.

    But in this case, you have NO IDEA what your pectoralis muscles look like, certainly not at their maximum size (i.e., your genetic potential). And it IS your genetics that determine size; neither one of you is anywhere close to their genetic potential. This isn't a slam! Most people aren't. ****, most people aren't after a decade of lifting.

    Think about those little foam dinosaurs you toss in water, you know, the ones that triple in size. They never REALLY change shape, just grow overall. But at various stages, certain parts may look larger than others. Eventually, the final size will be reached, but this SHAPE is predetermined. You cannot alter the shape of a muscle. Its shape is determined by its attachment points, the shape of the surrounding bones, the location and density of muscle fibers, etc.

    The muscle is designed (or adapted) to move your skeleton. It will NOT grow in such a way that this basic function is compromised. Sectional hypertrophy would ruin the integrity of the muscle, and upset the whole carefully balanced system of tendons, ligaments, fascia, etc. that make up any joint.

    So, long story short, unless proven otherwise, I maintain that you're wrong.


    Cliffs notes: STFU N00B!
    "Except Belial. He knows everything. This isn't a sarcastic attack, either. He really knows everything." -----Organichu
    "Alex is all knowing and perfect"-----Jane (loosely paraphrased)
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  12. #62
    Team Chesticles! Unholy's Avatar
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    Good post Alex.
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  13. #63
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Thanks man. I judge the quality of my posts by the number of little asterisk thingies in them.
    "Except Belial. He knows everything. This isn't a sarcastic attack, either. He really knows everything." -----Organichu
    "Alex is all knowing and perfect"-----Jane (loosely paraphrased)
    -515/745/700 bench/deadlift/squat
    Current mile time: 4:23
    Marathons: 3
    Century races: 3
    Ironmans: 1
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  14. #64
    Senior Member KoolDrew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belial View Post
    Thanks man. I judge the quality of my posts by the number of little asterisk thingies in them.
    LOL.

    I must say though, I have learned quite a bit from this topic.

  15. #65
    Senior Member dblockspky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belial View Post
    Hey mate, re-read. My point was that low-level activation does not imply stress leading to hypertrophy. I don't think anybody here is "choosing to be ignorant". Well, certainly not on the "no isolation" side of the argument.
    Hey buddy, re-read. I didn't direct my post towards you nor any other specific person in this thread. I was just making a statement.

  16. #66
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STATUS View Post
    Also, what movements make the definition in your arm-pit area more pronounced? Because my lower pecs lack a "bulky" look while my upper pecs and inner arms dont...

    See pic for refrance...
    Now we cant trust your judgement of your "upper growth". You cant define a muscle through exercise. You need to read some more yet.

    This is my point: Your "lower" pecs lack a bulky look? Yet youve benched.. hmm... I wonder what went wrong... OH WAIT! I know! Genetics.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

    Progress pics of a cut using bodyweight only movements http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/sho...45#post2405745

    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by STATUS View Post
    Also, what movements make the definition in your arm-pit area more pronounced? ..


    The movement of your fork to your mouth. Limit said movement and definition will occur at some point.

    Definition is gained by having low bodyfat. Lifting weights will not do any good in regards to that if you are overeating.

  18. #68
    Cardio bunny Alex.V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dblockspky View Post
    Hey buddy, re-read. I didn't direct my post towards you nor any other specific person in this thread. I was just making a statement.
    Hey spud, you posted in this thread, and your comments were directed at people involved in this argument, which means your statement was fair game.
    "Except Belial. He knows everything. This isn't a sarcastic attack, either. He really knows everything." -----Organichu
    "Alex is all knowing and perfect"-----Jane (loosely paraphrased)
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    Current mile time: 4:23
    Marathons: 3
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  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by dblockspky View Post
    I
    The argument is quite repetitive though, and really never does get solved. I think a lot of people don't like to accept what those that tell them that you can't isolate different areas of the chest because for 1) they can feel themselves that only certain areas of the chest feel fatigued after doing specific lifts and 2) when you're getting told by some random guy on the internet that claims that studies are false that makes it even harder to believe.

    Based on what we know about anatomy this arguement has been solved. You can not isolate. You MAY be able to emphazise certain areas more than others..that's never been in dispute. What IS in dispute is whether this extra emphasis is enough to cause a noticable difference...most of us don't think so based on our experiences and those of others. What I find most striking is that those who claim that it is possible and does make a difference have NEVER yet posted ONE picture to back up their claims.

    1. "feeling" is highly subjective. Nor can it be used as a gauge of much of anything. I feel it in my hands after a heavy deadlift workout..does that mean my hands will get bigger?


    2. Those weren't studies to begin with. Have they been put in a scientific journal? Have they been peer-reviewed? Were noticable results obtained from people doing just incline press? How many people were involved? Who did these "studies"?

    Finally if you have to use pro bodybuilders (whose advice is not applicable to the general population to begin with) to back up your point...it is very likely that your point is (a) utter rubbish (b) applies only to drug using genetically elite lifters.

    THE END.]







    please please let it be the end.
    Last edited by Songsangnim; 06-27-2007 at 08:47 PM.

  20. #70
    Senior Member Natetaco's Avatar
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    i think every study says pretty much the same thing. With incline bench you can emphasize SLIGHTY more on the upper region of the pec major, but the difference is so little it wouldnt make a noticeable difference.

    this needs to die.
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  21. #71
    Gaglione Strength Chris Rodgers's Avatar
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    Alex- excellent reference to the tiny foam dinosaurs. Those things friggin rocked!


    *Flexes upper chest and leaves*
    Last edited by Chris Rodgers; 06-27-2007 at 08:57 PM.
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  22. #72
    Risk10k Clifford Gillmore's Avatar
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    Can't flex bone Chris

  23. #73
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    I can assure you CR is jacked.
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  24. #74
    Risk10k Clifford Gillmore's Avatar
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    C'mon man, roll with me here. I mean if video adds 15lbs, he must be damn near invisible :O.









    I like to pick on other people cause I'm weak IRL

  25. #75
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    Rich, genetics can account for my not so "bulky" lower pecs?

    I wasn't aware lol...I thought I had been doing something wrong for the last 3-4 years? haha

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