View Full Version : Cut it out, train for strength

12-09-2001, 01:33 PM
Ok, here's my two-part fitness program. For the first month or so, I will be working on getting myself into better shape as well as establishing a routine to get myself cut to the BF I want, and then stay there while I move to the second part of the routine.
Once cut, I plan to begin training for strength -- continuing with a healthy diet and cardiovascular training.

After counting cals on average eating days, as well as using formulas in mags & online, they all seem to point to roughly the same daily calorie intake level: 1450-1500.
Previous to today I just watched my fat intake, I will now count everything I eat and try and get into a nice routine. If I find this is not enough cals, I will have to up it to an acceptable level.

Age: 18
Height: 65"
Weight: 135lbs
BF%: 11.5-12.5% (based on average of calculations & scale)

Goal: To get cut down to 8-9% BF by the end of January so I can commence strength training in February (2nd semester will allow me more time to dedicate to training).
Goal 2: To get into better cardiovascular shape, and once BF goal reached, to begin strength training.
Goal 3: To be able to balance a diet which will allow me to get through the day without feeling hungry constantly, and to maintain my BF% at an acceptable level.
Goal 4: To keep a fitness/nutrition journal daily.

~1450 cals.
Carbs: 196g
Protein: 107g
Fat: 24g

12-09-2001, 02:36 PM
I think you're the first person I've heard of who wanted to lose weight and then start on increasing strength. At 65", 135lbs, 11.5-12.5% bf you are already fairly lean. The old saw goes that putting on more muscle mass is the easiest way to burn fat, because that muscle is going to have a high metabolic maintenance requirement. What kind of workouts are you going to do now and starting in Janurary? Maybe you can start the strength gaining part of your program now.

12-09-2001, 02:57 PM
I've tried to get myself into a training routine before by just going right into it.. However, I haven't been able to stick with it. I want to establish good nutrition habits, and get myself doing exercise I really enjoy (karate and squash mainly) on a routine basis before I start into the more intense training. I'm basically trying to give myself a foundation of good habits, so when I start strength training, it will be easier to accept into my routine -- that's the theory behind it at least.

However, I might start some moderate weight training 2-3 times a week since Belial somehow convinced me I should try and fit it in. I've read more about training for size than straight strength (at least, I'm under the impression there's difference), so instead of doing the 6 reps in Flex (my bro used to get em :P) i'll probably go for about 12-15 for now. Basically i'll spend a day on legs, a day on shoulders & back, and the last on chest & arms. I haven't got access to a squat rack, or many of the back machines so i will have to improvise I guess.

Though I admit the prospect of me being large & ripped sounds appealing, I'd rather have less mass and more strength (proportionally). So if there's something I can do to reach that goal, I'm listening :)

12-09-2001, 02:57 PM
Not sure if you are aware of this, Chuck, but an 18 year old male, even one of your size, requires far more than 1400 calories to merely maintain his weight. At 18, your metabolism is the fastest it probably will ever be; furthermore, it is possible that you are not yet done growing. If so, such a diet could have long-term physiological consequences.

As an example, I am 5'7'', 18, 135 lbs, and currently below 8% bf. Do I eat 1400 calories per day? No. I eat close twice that amount, as do many of my friends, and my weight, as well as theirs, is constant.

12-09-2001, 03:10 PM
the 1450 is to get cut, but perhaps I've misjudged how much to cut out of my diet. The thing is, I've been able to keep a constant weight for almost the last 2 years -- I can eat just pizza & steak for a week and then the next week eat only chicken & veggies and not have any difference, so I find it difficult to find my daily intake required to maintain my weight. I took basically an average day, what I would eat to keep myself from feeling hungry and it was about 1950-2000.
oatmeal + apple
roast beef sandwich
2x pizzas (frozen)
1x chicken breast + fries + bun
1x salad + 1x bagel
Thats 1900 cals there. So assuming some nights i have some chips or crackers as additional snacks.. add a few hundred more? Perhaps I need to rethink this a little.. ?

Anyone else care to comment?

12-09-2001, 08:01 PM
why yes I would like to comment: :)

rule #1: do everything Belial says. He has helped me and a lot of other people greatly and knows what he is talking about.

rule #2: don't eat too little. 1400 calories is less than what I would eat, and I am a 16year old, 115pound girl. First of all, you'll slow your metabolism. You're young, growing, etc. You really shouldnt cut down your food intake like that, you might stunt your growth or just give yourself the nuisance of a slow metabolism (this is what I did). If you can eat pizza and bagels and maintain your already low bodyfat then why would you torture your body with diets? Switching to cleaner food is always a great idea, however. I suggest you bug Belial about the best thing to do in your situation. :D

(you might want to up your fat intake a little bit. I think it is around 15% now and imo, you'd be better off at 20-30%)

12-09-2001, 08:16 PM
Well now, I'm just going to blush and put up my e-mail address.


But until then....

1) Start lifting now. There's no reason to wait. Absolutely none.

2) Up your fat intake a little bit. You need more good fats in your diet. Throw in some almonds or fish.

3) Cut out the frozen pizzas, the bagels, and the fries. If you're eating to lose weight, make those calories count. Don't eat things devoid of nutritional value.

4) 1400 calories is too low. You're going to be exercising and lifting heavily, I hope. You'll need extra calories to fuel your workout and for repair. if anything, UP your cals to about 2000-2100.

You're in no rush. You're at an age where fat will drop off quickly, and muscle will build quite nicely. So don't do anything crazy like cutting cals too drastically, and please, never diet without lifting.

I'm sure you'll get lots of other good advice here, but feel free to hit me up at any time.

12-09-2001, 08:24 PM
First off, I've gotta blush a bit.. That sample day was what I was eating a few weeks ago.. a time where I wasn't getting much sleep either. Nonetheless, that's what I had been eating in a typical day. Same goes for fries.. :p I don't eat nearly that horribly anymore.

As far as the bagels -- I've noticed nobody ever talks about eating bread/buns.. is that because they're totally carbs or what? I like bread, so would whole wheat bread be a wiser choice?(which i like even more anyway.)

My initial reason for not lifting for now was so that I could ease myself into it. However, seeing as I've been spending as much time thinking about nutrition & excercise as I have recently, I think I can start a basic program. I won't be able to get to a gym regularly until feb. so until them I've just got freeweights and a bench, but I'm sure I can survive.

So essentially, the changes i'll be making to my diet will change from being a dramatic drop, to being roughly the same as what I'd normally eat, however it will be balanced much better. I'm going to try the 40/40/20 split you recommended, more protein would definitely help I think.. before i started watching my diet at all, a vast majority was made up of carbs.

I'm still trying to figure out what I need to do to put together a strength training program, but I can probably let you answer that in the thread I started in the Training forum.

Thanks for all of your help, hopefully within the next couple days, with some guidance from you all, i'll be able to have more realistic, beneficial goals. Thanks :)

12-09-2001, 08:25 PM
Why do you want to decrease your bf? Is it for a sport or competition, also whether you are cutting or not I would reccomend more than 107g of daily protein.

12-09-2001, 08:38 PM
Props to you for realizing the importance of starting good habits. You can do that and still work out, IMHO. As far as the caloric intake goes, I'd be homicidal if I only took in 1450 kCal /day. I didn't catch that the first time I ead your original post. If you do squash or whatever you can substantially increase that caloric intake.

12-09-2001, 09:14 PM
I remember the old days when people used to ask me for help. I guess becoming a loud opinionated jackass/weirdo kinda took away that particular duty.