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jtteg_x
06-27-2007, 04:36 PM
i know their are many PL routines out their to get a big bench. i need to ask what lifts has gave you a carryover to your bench? how many times did you work chest per week? how many times did you bench per week?


i am in need to figure why my bench (raw & shirted) isnt going up, but instead downhill. im progressing deadlift/squat but not bench. i have taken days off, done 1-4" boards, mini bands, average bands, CG/tricep work, floor press, bench 2x week, and shoulder work for the past 2-3 months and it just hasnt worked for me.

sometime during april/march 07, my best ever raw bench was 275lb and 315lb with loose shirt. till today, its the same. 2-3 weeks ago, i attempted my max raw/shirted bench again but failed it. i been eating the same since. if anything, ive actually gained minor pounds overall. what could i be doing wrong?

here is my training log which doesnt go too far back: http://www.wannabebigforums.com/showthread.php?t=96773


any advice?

RhodeHouse
06-27-2007, 04:42 PM
Look at Vincent's training log for raw advice, and check mine or TT's for Shirt benching. You can't work on both at the same time. Pick one and focus on it.

Bako Lifter
06-27-2007, 04:44 PM
How about just regular benching? Nothin special, just the basics. How long has it been since you've done that?

Also, I'm not sure how my bench came to be what it is, but the thing I do different from most is low incline dumbell press. I guess you could try that.

Lol, I'm not a big bencher though.

RhodeHouse
06-27-2007, 04:50 PM
I just looked at your training log. Here's a couple things about PLing

1. You train BENCH not chest
2. Train a movement not a muscle group - all back, shoulder, and triceps work is done to increase you BENCH.
3. Read EliteFTS.com - all the Powerlifting articles by Louie Simmons, Dave Tate, and Jim Wendler, or look at my training log and Vincent's training log, because that's what we do. You do WAY TOO much work.

rmccray
06-27-2007, 04:58 PM
Look at Vincent's training log for raw advice, and check mine or TT's for Shirt benching. You can't work on both at the same time. Pick one and focus on it.

WORD!!

jtteg_x
06-27-2007, 08:01 PM
i looked at your log and vincents as well. i see where your going when doing too much work. you guys train 3 compounds and other minor stuff. ill give that a try.

later today im doing bench, let me know what you guys think of this workout...

raw bench: 5x5
1 board: 3x3
3 board: 3x3
decline bench: 3x5

vdizenzo
06-27-2007, 08:31 PM
i looked at your log and vincents as well. i see where your going when doing too much work. you guys train 3 compounds and other minor stuff. ill give that a try.

later today im doing bench, let me know what you guys think of this workout...

raw bench: 5x5
1 board: 3x3
3 board: 3x3
decline bench: 3x5

Too much benching

Here is what I would do:
raw 5x5
pick one board and go 3x3
one lat exercise for 4x10
one bicep exercise for 4x10
2 sets of high rep pushdowns

Guido
06-27-2007, 09:51 PM
I'm with RhodeHouse in that you need to train bench, not "chest".

I always do flat barbell bench (mixing up sets reps), and then 1 or two variations, such as close grips or floor presses, and then focus on triceps. I might do weighted tricep dips, pressdowns, JM presses, or Kaz presses to focus on tri's.

I mostly focus on upping my raw bench during the early part of my cycles and then start shirt work about 4-5 weeks out from a meet.

levronefan
06-27-2007, 10:14 PM
eat more, A LOT MORE...you gain more weight your lift will go up..

Adam
06-27-2007, 11:38 PM
raw bench: 5x5
1 board: 3x3
3 board: 3x3
decline bench: 3x5

Too many big movements.

I do similar to what waws said above:
1 heavy bench movement
1-2 exercises for tri's
1 heavy row or pull lift
maybe something for delts and Bi's(but probably not haha)

K.I.S.S. <<--- Thats what I learned after years of training!

jtteg_x
06-28-2007, 01:53 AM
i wished i wouldve read this before i left the door but oh well.

heres what i did: raw bench: warmup, 205lbx5, 225lbx5 (5 sets)
3 board press: 275lbx3, 285lbx3, 285lbx3
floor press: 135lbx5, 205lbx5, 225lbx5 (3 sets)
3 sets of db curls
2 sets of hanging leg raises, crunches, and side bends.

http://www.wannabebigforums.com/showthread.php?t=96773&page=2


i was gonna do direct back/shoulder/tri work on another day and call it bench assist day.

NASAKYCHAIRMAN
06-28-2007, 06:40 AM
i looked at your log and vincents as well. i see where your going when doing too much work. you guys train 3 compounds and other minor stuff. ill give that a try.

later today im doing bench, let me know what you guys think of this workout...

raw bench: 5x5
1 board: 3x3
3 board: 3x3
decline bench: 3x5

Definitely, too many compound movements.

I would suggest doing 1- 2 compound movements.

Increase your protein & recuperation with AtLarge Nutrition Maximum Muscle Mass Stack. http://atlargenutrition.com/nutrition_detail.php?products_id=9


EXAMPLE ROUTINE
1st week
raw bp 5 x 5
pause close grip bp(4 sets)

2nd week
pause 3 board press(7-10 sets)

3rd week
Pause flooor press(7-10 sets)

4th week
raw bp 3 x 3
rack lockouts(4-6 sets)

5th week
pause 1 board press(7-10 sets)
Pause incline bp(4-5 sets)

6th week
Pause floor press(7-10 sets)
Pause decline bp(4-5 sets)

7th week
raw bp 5 x 5
Heavy weighted dips(4-5 sets)

8th week
Pause 5 board press
pause dumbbell bp(4-5 sets)


J.T. HALL
http://www.myspace.com/bigwillie12345
http://www.atlargenutrition.com

waynedang
06-28-2007, 06:09 PM
Welll I'm not a big bencher but when I am about 8-10 weeks out I get my shirt work in on one day with a set or two of 20 rep tricep pushdowns and some light assistance worrk on another day. My joints can no longer handle all the volume I did in the past. More is not always better. It took a long time for me to learn that.

Guido
06-28-2007, 08:30 PM
Oh, c'mon Wayne. I'd consider you a "big bencher". Benching 500lbs isn't bad weighing barely 220lbs.

jtteg_x
06-29-2007, 12:56 AM
how does this look for bench assistance day (for saturdays workout...2 days after bench)

db rows 3x8 (each arm)
military press 3x8
rear lat raise 2x10 (each arm)
weighted dips 3x12

smokinHawk
06-29-2007, 06:54 AM
I like to add close grip speed benching on my accessory/DE day, seems to help allot so i have a good benching day the next ME session.

jtteg_x
06-29-2007, 02:26 PM
should i add that or replace it with the dips?

Adam
06-29-2007, 03:46 PM
I would replace the dips.
CGBP is just overall better IMO than dips for bench strength. Mainly because the motions are similar.

GroundControl
06-29-2007, 04:52 PM
I wish I could bench.

Chris Rodgers
06-29-2007, 05:01 PM
I am not a big bencher, but I follow a routine that is basically the same as most of the guys on my team(and a bunch of them are strong).


The East End Barbell method(mostly stolen from John Bernor)

We bench 2 days per week. One day is devoted to shirt work. This is the day we would do heavy boards, heavy bands, Some do lockouts(John doesn't like them), Floor presses, etc.

The other day is a raw assistance day. Here we do a number of movements, but only 1-2 worksets of each. We start the cycle off with real high reps(like 15-20) and work it up each week ala progressive overload.


This combo has worked real good for most of us. Two heavy days a week can be brutal. The way we do it, we skip a heavy bench session usually once every 3-6 weeks.

waynedang
06-29-2007, 06:58 PM
Oh, c'mon Wayne. I'd consider you a "big bencher". Benching 500lbs isn't bad weighing barely 220lbs.

584 thank you very much:thumbup: still not 6 :cry:

waynedang
06-29-2007, 06:59 PM
I am not a big bencher, but I follow a routine that is basically the same as most of the guys on my team(and a bunch of them are strong).


The East End Barbell method(mostly stolen from John Bernor)

We bench 2 days per week. One day is devoted to shirt work. This is the day we would do heavy boards, heavy bands, Some do lockouts(John doesn't like them), Floor presses, etc.

The other day is a raw assistance day. Here we do a number of movements, but only 1-2 worksets of each. We start the cycle off with real high reps(like 15-20) and work it up each week ala progressive overload.


This combo has worked real good for most of us. Two heavy days a week can be brutal. The way we do it, we skip a heavy bench session usually once every 3-6 weeks.

What does a typical raw day look like for you guys?

Chris Rodgers
06-29-2007, 10:19 PM
What does a typical raw day look like for you guys?

This is copied from Bernor's journal. This was his raw workout earlier this week. He is getting ready to compete at the Cincinatti Pro-Am meet being run by Louie Simmons.

narrow grip(pointer on smooth)
390x11.PRAISE GOD

paused incline barbell
315x10

seated dumbell shoulder press
120'sx16

comp grip to 2 board with doubled purples
275x9..GOD IS AWESOME

barbell ext with doubled purple(60 sec btwn sets)
135x8
135x5
135x3

JESUS LIVES..DO U KNOW HIM????


Of course he is a freak of nature. I do similar things as far as reps, I just usually pick some different exerices(like declines, dips, etc.)

jtteg_x
06-29-2007, 11:45 PM
^are those 1 set per lift? what is bb ext?

vdizenzo
06-30-2007, 08:11 AM
I like the Westside template especially for new guys because it has them do assistance for upper body twice a week. I think newer/younger guys just need to concentrate on getting bigger/developing more muscle and the strength will come.

bigbadwolfe
06-30-2007, 10:25 AM
Here is my training log for my bench for the last few weeks. There is a couple of days missing where I did not add them for whatever reason (I forgot). But it gives a basic overview of what I do.

There is one day all out Max Effort work and the 2nd day is direct chest and pec work. Hope this helps.

Anyone wanting to follow my bench training I now log everything into the AtLarge Nutrition Myspace page at: www.myspace.com/atlargenutrition

Wolfy!!!!



Mike Wolfe Training Blog

Weds May 30th 2007
Dynamic Bench/Chest Day
Bench press ~
bar 12 reps
135 8 reps
225 8 reps
315 8 reps
405 10 reps
425 12 reps

Chest Press Machine ~
320 12 reps x 4 sets

Dumbbell Tricep Presses ~
100 12 reps x 4 sets
Tricep Straight bar pushdowns ~
100 12 reps
110 12 reps
120 12 reps
130 12 reps

25 minutes of Cardio ~ Walked on Treadmill at 3.2 MPH at a 10 degree incline

The workout went good and fast paced, lots of good sweat built up. Got all of this done in under 1 hour. I have changed my Dynamic Days from Speed work to more bodybuilding oriented workouts to try and tighten and tone my body sionce dropping the excess bodyweight.


7:05 PM - 3 Comments - 0 Kudos - Add Comment
AtLarge Nutrition


Took off a few days pulled a muscle in my lower back handing out to my training partner. But it is gone and we are back to full blown training as of Saturday June 2nd.

Here was my trainng for Saturday June 2nd ~

Max Effort day ~ Trained at local YMCA could not make it to Westside this weekend

Bench Press ~ All RAW work
135 8 reps
225 8 reps
315 3 reps off a 3 board
405 3 reps off a 3 board
495 3 reps off a 3 board
585 3 reps off a 3 board
600 1 rep off a 3 board
625 1 rep off a 3 board
650 1 rep off a 3 board
675 1 rep off a 3 board

Dumbbell Tricep Presses ~
120 pound dumbbells for 3 sets of 12 reps

Dumbbell JM Presses ~
50 pounds for 3 sets of 25 reps

Tricep Cable Pushdowns ~
100 pounds for 3 burnout sets

~ DONE ~

Monday June 4th ~ Shoulders and Traps and Cardio 25 minutes on Treadmill

Side Lateral Raises ~
35 pound dumbbells for 12 reps
45 pound dumbbells for 10 reps
55 pound dumbbells for 8 reps

Front Delt Raises (just added these back in)
50 pounds for 3sets of 8 reps

Rear Delt Cable Face Pulls ~
100 pounds 12 reps
130 pounds 10 reps
150 pounds 12 reps

Seated Cable Shoulder pullbacks ~ (Like a shrug with cables)
150 pounds for 10 reps
170 pounds for 10 reps
200 pounds(whole stack) for 10 reps

Dumbbell Shrugs ~
75 pounds for 3 sets of 12 reps

~ DONE ~

Tuesday June 5th ~ Back and Cardio 20 minutes on Treadmill

Seated Lat Pulldowns with Westside Barbell Backbar
2 warmups for 12 reps with 100 pounds
150 pounds for 8 reps
170 pounds for 8 reps
200 pounds for 10 reps (2 sets)

Close Grip Pulldown Same bar
150 pounds for 3 sets of 12 reps

Reverse Grip Pulldowns same bar
150 pounds for 8 reps
170 pounds for 8 reps
200 pounds for 6 reps

Two arm Dumbbell Rows
75 pound dumbbells for 4 sets of 8 reps

~ DONE ~

Wednesday June 6th ~ Chest and tris

THIS WHOLE WORKOUT WAS DONE IN THE DARK, POWER WENT OUT AT THE GYM AND ALL WE HAD WAS EMERGENCY FLOOD LIGHTS THAT DID NOT LIGHT UP NOTHING. I COULD NOT SEE THE BAR ON ALL MY BENCH SETS SO IT WAS LIKE BENCHING BLIND!!!!

Flat Bench Raw
135 for 12
225 for 12
315 for 3
365 for 3
405 for 12

Cable Flys (to dark for anything else about killed myself benching)
80 pounds for 4 sets of 12 reps

Dumbbell Tricep presses
125 for 12 reps
125 for 12 reps
150 for 17 reps (1 rep PR with the 150's)

Back Bar Pushdowns
50 pounds for 20 reps
100 pounds for 10 reps
150 pounds for 6 reps(HEAVY as Hell !!!!)

PreHab shoulder work for Rotators
15 pound dumbbells for 30 reps for 4 sets

NO CARDIO all Cardio equipment is electric :(

Posted by AtLarge Nutrition on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 at 6:05 PM
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AtLarge Nutrition


Thursday June 7th through Saturday June 9th I rested to get ready for a BIG bench weekend at Westside Barbell in Columbus.

Well really did not rest, I was busy helping get everything ready for 2 of my really good friends Kevin and Felicia's wedding that was on Saturday the 9th. My wife and myself were in the wedding a great wedding for 2 really great people.

Ok now on to June 10th Max Effort day at Westside Barbell ~

Flat Bench ~

warmups:
bar for 10
135 for 10
185 for 8
225 for 6
315 for 3
405 for 1
Put on new bench shirt, Rage X double ply
500 for 1 to a 4 board
585 for 1 to a 3 board
675 for 1 to a 3 board
765 for 1 to a 2 board
855 for 1 to a 2 board
905 for 1 to a 2 board
945 for 1 to a 2 board

*****DONE******
That was it I was pooped by then had some really good cuts from the bench shirt.

Monday June 11th Shoulders and Traps

No Cardio feet hurt from wearing dress shoes all day Saturday. Got some good blisters on feet. Weighed in at 331

Side Laterals with dumbbells
35 for 8
40 for 8
45 for 8
50 for 8 x 3 sets

Seated Side lateral machine(Chicken Wings)
100 for 12 x 4 sets

Front Delt Straight Bar Cable raises
100 for 8
120 for 8
140 for 8
150 for 8

Seated Face Pulls
150 for 12 reps x 4 sets

Dumbbell High Shrugs
90 pound dumbbells for 4 sets of 12 reps

****DONE******

Tuesday June 12th took the day off, kind of fighting a small cold I caught from my son. Felt miserable all day gonna load up on some antibiotics and rest for the day.

Posted by AtLarge Nutrition on Tuesday, June 12, 2007 at 3:03 PM
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AtLarge Nutrition


Ok guys just wanted to take a second to update everyone on my training. As far as my back, shoulders and traps it is basicly the same every week. But my bench training is what is constantly evolving. So here is my latest 2 bench workouts from the last 2 weekends in Columbus at Westside.

Sunday June 17th ~

Warmed up with bar then went
135 for 10
225 for 6
315 for 3
365 for 1
405 for 1
495 for 1
585 with shirt to 4 board
635 with shirt to 3 board
675 with shirt to 3 board
725 with shirt to 2 board
765 with shirt to 2 board
825 with shirt to 2 board
875 with shirt to 1 and a half board
900 with shirt to 1 and a half board

Tricep pushdowns 4 sets of 12 with 100 pounds

*****Done*****

Sunday June 24th

Flat bench~
warm up bar
135 for 10
225 for 3
275 for 3
315 for 1
365 for 1
405 for 1

Warmed up now, moved over to power rack for Heavy Raw Foam Presses

High Foam presses ~

495 for 1
585 for 1
695 for 1
785 for 1
835 for 1
855 for 1 missed at top end

Back Bar Pushdowns 4 sets of 10 reps with 100 pounds
Thick Straight Bar Pushdowns 4 sets of 10 reps with 50 pounds

*****DONE*****

Posted by AtLarge Nutrition on Sunday, June 24, 2007 at 6:27 PM

chris mason
06-30-2007, 11:06 AM
Wolfe is getting scary strong!